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Herbert, Frank: How do the newer Dune series books compare with the Originals?

Cozener

Member
Joined
Oct 6, 2006
Messages
23
The prequels don't compare to the originals...in much the same way that md 20/20 doesn't compare with chateau lefite rothchild.
 

nromanek

The Cyclopedia Of Worlds
Joined
Apr 13, 2007
Messages
6
I'm very interested to hear that the later books are worthwhile. I'm just now rereading the original trilogy - and am even more knocked out by them the second time around (although, if I'm honest, I have to admit that "Children Of Dune" feels a little - just a little - messy). I remember "God Emperor of Dune" not quite clicking with me when I first read it years back, but I'm eager to read it again.

I have virtually sworn off all books after "God Emperor", because what makes the books so good is not just the great sci-fi universe and drama, but also the beautiful and poetic interweaving of themes, motifs, characters.

I have been too hasty? "Chapterhouse", "Heretics", etc...here I come!
 

Tarl_Cabot

A warriors coin is steel
Joined
Feb 28, 2007
Messages
26
I have read all of them and loved them all. The first Dune novel is one of only three books I have ever had to re-buy because I have read and re-read the book to the point it has physically fallen appart.
 

Quokka

wandering
Joined
Mar 26, 2005
Messages
1,403
*Prequel Spoilers*


I enjoyed the prequels well enough although I havent read the last one or two yet. The writting and storylines were fine though never a patch on Dune, which I didn't really expect, its got to be impossibly hard to write an extension to what really is a classic.

But all through the series there was one thing that really, really bugged me. The prequels took all the major factions in the Dune universe, the Spacing Guild, the AI ban, Bene Besserit, Melange use etc. (Sorry I could be wrong on some of them its been awhile since I read them but hopefully you know what I mean) and had them all develop within the timeframe of a generation or two.

It was all just too convienient, personally I would have preferred it if the books had moved around within a few thousand years prior to the events of Dune and told the story of how these factions developed without needing to have so many historical events happen at the one time.
 

Timewalker

Orthodox Herbertarian
Joined
Oct 1, 2006
Messages
59
*Prequel Spoilers*

But all through the series there was one thing that really, really bugged me. The prequels took all the major factions in the Dune universe, the Spacing Guild, the AI ban, Bene Besserit, Melange use etc. (Sorry I could be wrong on some of them its been awhile since I read them but hopefully you know what I mean) and had them all develop within the timeframe of a generation or two.

It was all just too convienient, personally I would have preferred it if the books had moved around within a few thousand years prior to the events of Dune and told the story of how these factions developed without needing to have so many historical events happen at the one time.
Agreed. The two things that irritate me most about the Butlerian Jihad trilogy is that A. Past history as established by Frank Herbert himself was ignored in favor of having all of the above happen pretty much at the same time, and B. Norma Cenva seems to have invented everything up to, and possibly including, the proverbial kitchen sink! :mad:

Yes, different writers will have a different way of expressing themselves. But it's unforgiveable to ignore established history -- for example, Frank Herbert established that the Bene Gesserit pre-date the start of the Jihad.
 

Marvolo

Medium Rare
Joined
Apr 8, 2007
Messages
253
Location
I like SF&F
I just want to start out by saying that I deeply love Frank Herberts Dune series. I've got them all, and I've read all of them atleast two or three times. So when it was announced that his son was going to write new books based on Frank's left over notes I was thrilled.

Of the new books I've read the two first prequals and The Butlerian Jyhad. House Atreides wasn't so bad, even though it was nothing like Frank's books it managed to introduce the world coherently and most characters were interesting. I didn't care much for the plot and it was evident that Brian and Kevin thinks that the more plot you have the better it is. I really liked the original Dune's introspective political and philosophical themes, but in the new books there was little of that.

While reading House Harkonnen I started to actively dislike the plot. The whole artifical spice thing is retarded, especially since there is no mention of it in the Dune books that take place just a few decades after. Most of the other plots are equally retarded and I don't think I will bother reading to read House Corrino.

What can I say about Butlerian Jyhad? I think this sums it up pretty good:
Penny Arcade! - Honesty Time

This books is an insult to Frank Herbert legacy and quite possibly on of the worst sci-fi novels I've ever read.
I believe that House Corrino attempted to take a worm off Arrakis later didn't they? Also, didn't the Bene Tleilax begin to produce massive amounts of spice later on, destroying the monopoly that Arrakian inhabitants had on spice?

What is so out there about it? Other factions attempted to find ways around needing Dune for spice many times.
 

DMFW

Member
Joined
Sep 6, 2007
Messages
11
I've read and greatly enjoyed all the Frank Herbert originals (thought I thought the first four up to God Emperor of Dune to be the best).

Sorry, but I am not getting on at all well with any of the prequels... I've read The Butlerian Jihad and started House Harkonnen but just stopped about six months ago from lack of interest and feel no desire to continue. I guess my main objection is that the style of the writing is so much shallower than the originals. I feel that all the complex history so lovingly crafted in the orginal books is being recycled into cheap and easy "adventures" where all the philosophical and political sublety is totally lost. The machine culture in the Butlerian Jihad just did not convince me at all!

I don't know if anyone else has read it but for another trip into the Dune universe I actually much prefered the Dune Encyclopdia:-

Dune Encyclopedia

whilst it may not be official "cannon" (and isn't as ambitious as a new story) I think it is truer to the original spirit of Frank Herbert's imagination. Anyone else think the same?
 

sarakoth

Uncool
Joined
Sep 13, 2007
Messages
187
Out of the Dune prequals, I prefer Legends of Dune.

It is interesting to read an entire series of novels whose contents are only hinted at and whose plot was made lengendary in the original Dune series.
 

bokewyrmm

bookewyrmm
Joined
Nov 16, 2007
Messages
1
Out of the Dune prequals, I prefer Legends of Dune.

It is interesting to read an entire series of novels whose contents are only hinted at and whose plot was made lengendary in the original Dune series.
I agree, The Legends Trilogy is MUCH better than the Machine War Trilogy.

Hunters and Sandworms are like the Phantom Menace of the Dune universe, it completes the story, but it's not very fulfilling.
 

iansales

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 8, 2006
Messages
3,447
I've read the House trilogy. I've read the Legends trilogy. I've read Hunters of Dune, and I've nearly finished Sandworms of Dune. I think I've suffered enough.

The House trilogy was entertaining, although bizarrely pitched at young teenagers. The Legends trilogy was just plain... execrable. The two "sequels" to Frank Herbert's Dune books are even worse than that. They contain idiot plots at their most idiotic - not only do a couple of the characters have to be idiots for the story to progress, the entire population of the universe has to behave like complete idiots for the story to actually reach its resolution!
Someone should set off an EMP above Kevin J Anderson's house :)
 

Timewalker

Orthodox Herbertarian
Joined
Oct 1, 2006
Messages
59
I've read the House trilogy. I've read the Legends trilogy. I've read Hunters of Dune, and I've nearly finished Sandworms of Dune. I think I've suffered enough.

The House trilogy was entertaining, although bizarrely pitched at young teenagers. The Legends trilogy was just plain... execrable. The two "sequels" to Frank Herbert's Dune books are even worse than that. They contain idiot plots at their most idiotic - not only do a couple of the characters have to be idiots for the story to progress, the entire population of the universe has to behave like complete idiots for the story to actually reach its resolution!
Someone should set off an EMP above Kevin J Anderson's house :)
What is an "EMP"? :confused:
 

iansales

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 8, 2006
Messages
3,447
And whatever he uses to dictate his fiction when he's out hiking.
 
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