Fictional languages

[Joshua Jones]

Is anyone else working on a fictional language? There doesn't seem to be many resources on this matter, so I would love this to be a place where we can compare notes and let other who know multiple real world languages input some ideas.

So, who else is working on a language? What would you like to share about it? Anything you are struggling with?

 

[Joshua Jones]

I'll kick things off with a language from my WiP, K'Shanni'Tosk. Nouns rely heavily on prefixes and suffixes. The prefix is an identifier, and may either be a pronoun or a personal name, while the suffix indicates if it is possessive, function in sentence (no extra suffix=subject, -ot- = direct object, -im- = indirect object), and the like. The name of the language actually features much of this. "K'" is a gender neutral, plural first person, "Shan" is a proper noun, and "(redouble of last letter)ai" is a possessive which belongs to the whole referred group (there is also a partial possessive). K'Shan is also the proper name of a race of biological terraformation constructs who use this language, so the group possessive form functions as a proper name indicator for Tosk, which means language, communication, breath, or thought.

Adjectives conjugate to take the place of the identifier on the noun, so they require a repeating of the noun when used in the first sentence on a subject (K'Shan Khyrek'Shan = We K'Shan are strong, K'Shan Khyres'Shan = the K'Shan is strong).

If anyone is interested, I can discuss verbs, adjectives, and alphabet as well.

 

[goldhawk]

Try the Language Creation Society.

 

[Brian G Turner]

I've posted a few resources for learning languages here: https://www.sffchronicles.com/threads/567933/

The Langfocus channel on YouTube is especially good for explaining the diversity of languages, and their differences - and really underlines to me the difficulties of creating a fictional language.

I might suggest most people consider a very narrow focus if they must use fictional words - such as commonly used ones, for example - presuming that the POV characters are non-native speakers.

Additionally, something totally glossed over in epic fantasy and historical fiction is just how much languages have been standardized in modern times - in the mediaeval period and earlier, dialects were the norm, to the point that regional variations might be difficult for someone to understand if from outside of that area, even if they both technically spoke the same language.

The diversity of the romance group of languages is a great example of this, and the Langfocus channel goes deeper into historical dialects.

 

[night_wrtr]

I might suggest most people consider a very narrow focus if they must use fictional words - such as commonly used ones, for example - presuming that the POV characters are non-native speakers.

I applaud anyone that goes into that much detail. I have used created words and phrases in stories before, but never thought past that into an actual functional language. Just enough to make it feel like it enriches the story and world.

 

[EJDeBrun]

I have a fictional language with several dialects in my current WIP. The grammar follows the basic subject - object - perdicate format and I have a visual sense of the language. Chapters that are written from the alien MC POV all start with a native language proverb or saying, alphabetized and then translated.

I also keep a language dictionary of words I've created with grammar and conjugation notes.

 

[Onyx]

I've never understood how having sections of fake language in a narrative isn't just a huge info dump. What is it about putting encoded words on the page and then translating them that increases the enjoyment of the reader?

 

[night_wrtr]

I've never understood how having sections of fake language in a narrative isn't just a huge info dump. What is it about putting encoded words on the page and then translating them that increases the enjoyment of the reader?

As a reader, I enjoyed the few "Old Tongue" phrases that popped up in The Wheel of Time every now and then. Whether or not Robert Jordan had a complete language or not, he was fairly consistent with repeated words and such. It was fun when he stopped translating certain phrases, but those of us who remember a few books back when the words were used initially might get a chuckle when realizing the context.

 

[EJDeBrun]

I've never understood how having sections of fake language in a narrative isn't just a huge info dump. What is it about putting encoded words on the page and then translating them that increases the enjoyment of the reader?

I actually quite enjoyed a lot of the translations and explanations found in Watership Down. I felt like it really enhanced the world view of the rabbits.

 

[Joshua Jones]

I've never understood how having sections of fake language in a narrative isn't just a huge info dump. What is it about putting encoded words on the page and then translating them that increases the enjoyment of the reader?

That is an excellent question. Typically speaking, I don't use such sections, but use my language as a basis for how characters, ships, and the like are named. When my characters don't understand the language, they report in the narrative something like "The creature babled something in his incomprehensible tongue. Something that sounded angry. The fact that he started charging, claws extended, confirmed this suspicion." Other times, a protagonist may understand, but another character may not. In such a case, I may have a few lines in the language, then have the protagonist give a brief translation.

The point, in my mind, is to engage the reader in the wider universe without leaving the focus on the character, as well as give some insight into the general linguistic abilities of the characters.

 

[Joshua Jones]

I have a fictional language with several dialects in my current WIP. The grammar follows the basic subject - object - perdicate format and I have a visual sense of the language. Chapters that are written from the alien MC POV all start with a native language proverb or saying, alphabetized and then translated.

I also keep a language dictionary of words I've created with grammar and conjugation notes.

I like the idea of having a native language proverb at the beginning of such chapters. Being I am planning on including a relevant piece of background information before chapters (a diagram of an orbital colony, an advert for a fictional movie, and so forth), adding proverbs to the list would make sense for my work.

 

[-K2-]

Varied languages whether actual or fictional in my writing has played a big part for very personal reasons.

Beyond those personal reasons, I have discovered that varied languages within a fictional story, simply by virtue of the characters not being able to understand one another can setup some great moments. A good example of this you may have seen is the movie 'Hell in the Pacific' with Lee Marvin and Toshiro Mifune, wherein a U.S. and Japanese pilot find themselves encountering one another on a deserted island.

My first effort at building a fictional language, began as I was playing a chat-based RPG, my primary character a barbarian. Throughout the many years I played, the culture of that barbarian clan grew and expanded, and along with it the language. Besides adding a richness to the character, the misunderstandings, conflicts in culture and language, all vastly improved play for all a considerable amount. Though my character was the only one who spoke it (along with a pidgin Crown/English), in time many people had picked up enough to converse simply.

Currently what I'm working on, also has a language attached to it. Pastoral Pidgin. Pidgin, slang, expletives and so on all of us have used at one time or another and still do. We've all no doubt when younger even intentionally used it whether to seem 'hip' (yeah, I'm old), try to have some secret code or simply generate a common bond with our peers.

In any case, the most important thing IMO to remember when developing a new language, is to have a very firm grasp of the culture using it.

Ex.: Police have their bits of slang they use... So how would it read if an officer responded to central dispatch; "I can dig-it central dispatch. Everything is groovy here. Car 302 is making like a banana and splits."

So really focus on that. For my barbarians, the number/quantity "three" was considered sacred. So was balance. Too weak or too strong, unfaithful. Naturally there was much more to it, however, by knowing the culture of the people so well (naturally it helping that I devised that culture), I could develop a language that fit their deepest values and mindsets. It truly helped the process considerably.

Nevertheless, if you start there it will come off as much more reasonable than just some random words.

I'll mention a bit more of my experiences (though by no means of quality, simply what I have discovered) when I have more time.

K2

 

[EJDeBrun]

I like the idea of having a native language proverb at the beginning of such chapters. Being I am planning on including a relevant piece of background information before chapters (a diagram of an orbital colony, an advert for a fictional movie, and so forth), adding proverbs to the list would make sense for my work.

Sounds neat! And I think, considering your other possibilities, there's room for workplace slogans! "Only press the red button if you want to see red!"

I maybe should have added that I'm trilingual but have actually studied 4 languages outside of English (Mandarin, Japanese, Spanish and Latin) so I get a huge kick out of doing all this language stuff.

 

[ZlodeyVolk]

I see @Brian G Turner has already mentioned the Langfocus YouTube channel, but a few months back I stumbled across Artifexian's channel, which includes a lot of videos on the subject of world building, in general, and no few on the subject of creating fictional languages—exempli gratia:

You might find some useful information here, too.

 

[ZlodeyVolk]

I've never understood how having sections of fake language in a narrative isn't just a huge info dump. What is it about putting encoded words on the page and then translating them that increases the enjoyment of the reader?

Newspeakers unbellyfeel oldthink.

I can think of several good reasons to at least have a fictional language in mind, when writing. First and foremost is the one which is exemplified by Orwell's Newspeak: a fictional language can be used to show that some concepts simply cannot be parsed by the thought processes of other cultures.

Related to this is the idea that you can show/tell a lot about your fictional species by demonstrating which concepts they can express and those for which they have no words.

Lastly, it prevents all those pesky questions about why all the aliens are speaking a well-known terrestrial language during encounters with humans, without always resorting to 'they babbled', 'they jabbered', and such as. Used sparingly, of course.

 

[ZlodeyVolk]

Dang it … duplicate post.

 

[Onyx]

Newspeakers unbellyfeel oldthink.

I can think of several good reasons to at least have a fictional language in mind, when writing. First and foremost is the one which is exemplified by Orwell's Newspeak: a fictional language can be used to show that some concepts simply cannot be parsed by the thought processes of other cultures.

Related to this is the idea that you can show/tell a lot about your fictional species by demonstrating which concepts they can express and those for which they have no words.

Lastly, it prevents all those pesky questions about why all the aliens are speaking a well-known terrestrial language during encounters with humans, without always resorting to 'they babbled', 'they jabbered', and such as. Used sparingly, of course.

I guess I wasn't thinking of dialects like "newspeak" that are English with different rules, but true artificial languages like Klingon with zero shared vocabulary. Unless you intend to teach the reader to acquire some sort ability to read it, it is just jibberish. You can write the jibberish or you can describe the jibberish, I just don't really see why an author would want to invest themselves greatly in the technicalities of what will always be jibberish to the reader. It makes sense the Tolkien did it - that was what he studied as an academic. And it makes sense for an audio medium, like a TV show.

I called it in "infodump" earlier because presented the grammar or vocabulary of a fake language is like presenting the service instructions for a warp drive - even though neither are important to the story.

 

[ZlodeyVolk]

Oh, giving a reader an Orcish primer during the course of a narrative would definitely be an infodump. But used in dribs 'n' drabs, it's not so bad.

 

[-K2-]

Contrary to some, I truly enjoy inspiring emotions in those who read what I write. Some argue that it might detract from "their" story if a reader has to think about something, becomes emotional or confused. However, I believe that it can help immerse a reader into the story even deeper, and if used properly find themselves understanding characters better.

A reader's confusion if used sparingly and mimicking the character's confusion when encountering an unknown language will help the reader to relate. The same works for suddenly finding the character finally understanding just as the reader does. That sense of relief and "I get it now."

It can also make a mundane discussion between two characters suddenly exotic. Ex.: "Du varta vorta'mon pas'ghey? You speak Hamr, yes?"

There is nothing saying that the non-English speaking character cannot be bilingual. Although, I myself in such cases will often have that character utilize a mix of both. Partly demonstrating their limited English vocabulary, partly out of pride, and at other times to try and teach the other character the language (which we all often do when speaking with someone who has trouble with English).

You can even use it to help show the mood of a character without explaining that mood. Perhaps every time that character gets angry they speak in their native tongue, or perhaps just when they curse. Other times they might have one or two word expressions that they consistently utilize to express this or that emotion. There is a lot that can be done with it to give a story just that much more.

K2

 

[Onyx]

Contrary to some, I truly enjoy inspiring emotions in those who read what I write. Some argue that it might detract from "their" story if a reader has to think about something, becomes emotional or confused.

I don't think reading something that isn't understood or understandable is "confusing or emotional". I'm say that the difference between "Mapanglaw na bundok na umiiyak na mga ilog" and "Ilspen gai arabeetal ong fwai" is that one of those is an example of a complete language and the other I made up clusters of letters. But to a reader, they are both impenetrable, and the effort the author made to create a language is lost on them. So why did the author go to the trouble of creating a language if they have no intention of the reader learning it?

If some is someone else, pardon me for answering for them.