Crossing the line

[Jo Zebedee]

The book that I'm currently working on is written for adults, but the protagonists are sixteen in it, and there is a younger child protagonist, plus some adult pov characters as well. I know from feedback in the past that my writing style would be fine as YA, and the nature of the story is YA in this one.


However, I do seem to have this tendency, annoying as it is, of starting with a YA protagonist, and following them through a series, which is what I did last time, and which is where plannning is taking me with this one, too.

So, do I sell them as adult, which is the less popular of the two genres?

Or as YA, knowing that the sequels probably won't be. (I suppose, if stuck in a corner and told to write, I could make them YA, but it isn't what I'm planning.)

Or do I say they have cross over appeal and risk looking like an indecisive eejit?

 

[Juliana]

I think it depends a bit on how old you plan to make your characters at the end of the series. If you are not going too far, say up to around 20, early 20's, you can probably keep within YA. In Eragon, for instance, he's 15 or 16 in the first book but grows up in the series (I think he's around 20 at the end?).

Also, I think its probably more about how appropriate you keep the theme than about age itself.

Just my 2c but I imagine its easier to keep it within the YA genre, which plenty of adults read, anyway, than crossover midway.

 

[Ursa major]

First of all, the age of (some of) the protagonists.... Not counting the prologue, the first chapter of GRRM's rather dark fantasy, A Song of Ice and Fire, is written from the point of view of a seven-year-old (Bran). For those people who skip prologues, the lead up to, and the act of, beheading on the first two or three pages of that Bran chapter probably gives the game away that it isn't YA.

Regarding how you pitch your work.... Personally, if I started reading a series marketed as YA, I wouldn't be too happy if it became Adult part way through. But I suppose that depends on what is meant by Adult. I haven't read any Harry Potter, but I understand it becomes darker in the later books. (To be fair, having seen the first four or five films, the HP story has never been all sweetness and light). In the unlikely event that your series develops into serious horror, or a foul-mouthed bonkfest, you may have problems. Otherwise, isn't it just a matter of degree?

.

 

[Jo Zebedee]

Plenty of cussing, no bonking as yet, but I wouldn't neccessarily rule it out at some stage.

It does get to me a bit, having to define a genre. I write about people, and they tend to move up through life, and that interests me...

Juliana, last time by book two everyone was in their 30s. I don't plan that to be the case this time, but by book three it's looking likely, so I think it probably does push YA.

Although that time even book one wasn't very YA, whereas this one is a bit more, I think. I'll see what others think when they read it...

Oh, heck, I think I'll say adult and not limit the story line. I'd rather limit the market and consign another to kindle if needs be, rather than write something I think might be false in the long run.

*memo to self, next time must not get emotionally attached to characters, and want to know what they become*...

 

[Abernovo]

I'm not sure if this is strictly a genre, but in describing it, you could say that the series as a whole is aimed at the 15-40 age range. An adult-oriented series that would also appeal to the upper end of the YA market.

You've got naughty words in it? I'm shocked!

 

[Jo Zebedee]

You've got naughty words in it? I'm shocked!

Ha, are the Scots not the other nation who use curse words as an extended dialogue... I have to be true to the venacular.

(better not let my Mum read it, she told me off for it the last time. )

 

[Vertigo]

I would go for adult. If I'm on the first book of a series and the main protagionist is, say, 16 then I'm probably going to assume that they'll be older by the end of the series and so am usually happy to put up with that younger POV to start with.

But don't forget that just because the POV is young it doesn't mean the story is necessarily YA. Just write it in the same spirit as the rest of the story if the setting is more family than later on it would only be natural that there will be less 'naughtiness' but that doesn't make it YA.

In other words a young POV in an adult world is not automatically YA.

 

[Dozmonic]

no bonking as yet, but I wouldn't neccessarily rule it out at some stage.

If you call it bonking in the book, this qualifies it for YA rather than adult

Some work is crossover and liked by all ages. Pullman's Dark Materials aren't really children's fiction, the protagonist just happens to be a child growing up. Neil Gaiman's stuff is traditionally crossover, liked by young and old alike.

If you're starting it at YA and the characters grow up in future books, the readers will accept that on the whole because they, too, will have grown up as they've read it. For those who read it when you've already got 5 books out, they'll start at the beginning where they can and it'll be a glimpse into the future for them.

 

[SciFrac]

Has anyone produced a series that started in character and style at a very young age, then carried it through to a fully adult novel by end? Like a story with a 10 year old that sounds very young, and by book 12 they are 80 years old and the language sounds fully adult? Just curious how far one could carry their audience.

 

[Jo Zebedee]

In other words a young POV in an adult world is not automatically YA.

I think this is very true, Vertigo (nice to see you back, btw! ), and probably hits the nail on the head.

Has anyone produced a series that started in character and style at a very young age, then carried it through to a fully adult novel by end? Like a story with a 10 year old that sounds very young, and by book 12 they are 80 years old and the language sounds fully adult? Just curious how far one could carry their audience.

I wouldn't rule it out, it sounds kind of interesting. Hmm space heroes on zimmer frames... I like it.

 

[HareBrain]

Has anyone produced a series that started in character and style at a very young age, then carried it through to a fully adult novel by end? Like a story with a 10 year old that sounds very young, and by book 12 they are 80 years old and the language sounds fully adult? Just curious how far one could carry their audience.

Possibly not quite but you mean, but it almost fits: Alan Garner has just brought out Boneland, in which one of the child protagonists of The Weirdstone of Brisingamen is now in his sixties, and which from the sound of it is a much more adult book.

 

[AnyaKimlin]

Having a YA protagonist doesn't make the book YA as others have said. It is more to do with style but also the issues dealt with.

There is something called Crossover fiction - the most famous example of which would be Tales of the Otori by Lian Hearne. Across the Nightingale Floor was classed as YA, but her protagonist aged (I can't remember how old he was by the end) and it tends to appear in both sections of the library/bookshop. It began dark.

 

[SciFrac]

Alan Garner has just brought out Boneland, in which one of the child protagonists of The Weirdstone of Brisingamen is now in his sixties, and which from the sound of it is a much more adult book.

Yeah, that sounds about right. Where'd you get that snip?

 

[Warren_Paul]

I should point you in the direction of Tad Williams Shadowmarch quartet. The protagonists are teenagers, yet it is definitely not YA. I don't think the age of the character matters, but more the style of the writing.

You can write adult fiction with a teenage protagonist. What you can't do is write YA without one - at least not properly.

I would lean towards selling them as adult, yet many YA readers also read adult fiction anyway, so I'm not sure if it really matters. There is the difference though that there are many YA agents around compared to adult sff.


As an answer to another question asked. Robin Hobb starts off with the main character being a child and so does Kate Elliot in her two latest trilogies. I definitely wouldn't call The Crossroads Trilogy YA, considering it starts with a romantic scene involving descriptive nudity. Lynn Flewelling's series also starts off with a teenage protagonist yet deals with very adult themes - of the homosexual nature.

 

[AnyaKimlin]

There are YA books with elderly protagonists and others with adults that are surrounded by teenagers. The only one coming to mind right now is Sarah Jane Adventures but there are others of a similar ilk.

There are also YA books with sex.

 

[Vertigo]

nice to see you back, btw!

Thanks! Life caught up for a while and I'm still going to be hard pushed to stay ahead of it for the next 2 or 3 months. Que sera sera.

 

[monsterchic]

I'd go with YA, because as a teen myself, if I start a series where the main characters start as teens and grow up, I will read the next books even if they're older.

 

[Scott R. Forshaw]

I, personally, see your work as being more adult themed, Springs, so I'd probably be inclined to push you down that road. Yes, the protagonists are younger, but the overall story is much more adult in content. Of course, I've only read Abendaus Children, but going off that, I'd definitely put you in the adult category. Not to mention, I'd hate to see that torture scene toned down in favour of a younger audience. It's great, and still manages to give me nightmares.

 

[Jo Zebedee]

Ah, see now, my new mantra is no torture, ever again. Ever. There has been quite enough. (It has been toned down, a little, actually. One scene less, and a change of emphasis.) Definitely the Abendau stuff isn't YA, although I once tried to convince myself it was.
The new stuff isn't just as dark, thankfully, but I'm coming around to the idea - thanks to this thread - that's its probably not exploring the issues that YA focus on.
Thanks everyone for your thoughts.

 

[Glitch]

You seem more happy with it as adult.