Who thinks that George R.R. Martin is a genius?

I see what you mean. The folk beliefs, like old Nan's stories, seem to be just tacked in there, and not really leshed out. It might be deliberate though, if it's going to be a case of history repeating itself and those storie being slightly prophetic or something. I don't really know

Lady Fel, I bow to your superior knowledge. I havn't studied much Brit history prior to the ascention of the Tudors. Now Elizabeth I, there's an interesting monarch!
What Martin does brilliantly, though, is cover detail. A good lie needs detail, and good stories need lots of it. Martin references so much detail in every scene that it's hard to not see a lot of truth in it - and that's what helps to make the whole character experience all the more real.
I said:
Whoah! Ned Stark as Richard III? Well, they were both demonised...but Richard III was deprived of the throne by Henry VII at the Battle of Bosworth Field.
I sort of meant more of the earlier backgroung...raised in the North, seems cold, misunderstandings with Edward, stuff like that...He hated going to court because he didn't like the political games being played...And you must admit there's a parallel between Ned making a play to have Robert's children proclaimed illegitimate and what really happened when Edward IV died...

aimee, I'm not too keen on Elizabeth for some reason, I admit she was a great monarch and ruler, but she was way too vain and silly in other aspects of her reign...
The Starks could be compared to the Percy family, who ruled over Northumberland for the past thousand years or so.
Heh, Henry Percy - aka, Hotspur - makes quite an impact in Shakespeare's Henry IV, Part 1. I would have thought him perhaps nearer Jaime Lannister than a stark, though. :)
I am reading Bernard Cornwell's Vagabond, and Lord percy makes an appearance in the battle with the Scots at Durham city. Fantastic!
Only found Martin recently - love it. Will now wait for all books to be released before reading any further & treat myself to a Martin feast. Easily one of the best so far - hope he finishes as strongly as he started.
Well, I can't comment on ASOIAF at length, but his plotting in a shorter format is prertty tight, based on his sf short-story collection, Sandkings.

However, he is needlessly cruel. For example, this sentance from the latest excerpt on his site describes a terribly harsh fate for someone who isn't equipped with a birth canal:

Nine sons had been born from the loins of Quellon Greyjoy, the Lord of the Iron Islands.
You ABSOLUTELY HAVE to read that series!!!! READ the series! Look into the eyes of the cat ... "R E A D T H E S E R I E S ! !".

It really is a great series I am sure you will love it!:D
Definitely give this series a try! :)

I couldn't say if GRRM is like Bujold, I don't recall ever reading anything by that person.

Also, welcome to our forum KennyLucius...stick around you might like it around here.:D

Hi hodor, welcome back!:D
That book by Bujold is described here:


It won the Hugo this year, so I gave it a try. It wasn't awful, but it's just not my cup o' fun. The plot seemed a little "fluffy" or something...I'm not too good at describing literature, as you can see ;)

I guess I'll give GRRM a try--I'm always looking for a new author to get excited about.
I hope you enjoy the series...it seems to be a love/hate thing with his series. :D
Hes ok. i don't know if i would have stuck with the first book if it hadn't been a book club special, but now i'm hooked. and still waiting for the new one
BTW you lot ain't off the hook for getting me onto a series that not finished yet!
*waggles a warning finger*
That's ok, we haven't been waiting as long as some of the other fans have!:D

Try the Briar King...it'll start you off on another series.;) :D
Orthandor said:
Has anyone noticed that Westoros reminds them of dark age Britan?And that the Khalasaar sounds alot like Khazaar(the mongol monarchy in the late medieval period).I can see all the different great houses being countries too.Even the land looks close to the same.

Stark- Scots
Tully - Northumbrians or as there called now yorkshireman
Lannister - Welsh
Tyrell- Mercian
Baretheon- Danish england (danelaw)
Martell- Saxons
Greyjoy- Irish

I can see why you may come to the conclusion that there are valid comparisons between the houses/peoples you mention in terms of rough geography but beyond that it doesnt really hold. House Stark/The North stands up fairly well for the Scots vut Baretheon,Tyrell,Martell,Tully and Lannister would all be fairly homogeneous and all within the confines of England. House Greyjoy bears little resemblance to the Island of Ireland nor to the Irish people although they seem to be based either upon the Vikings of the Northern Isles - Orkney and Shetland, as well Northern mainland Scotland - or alternatively the scottish Lordship of the Isles which covered the Western Isles and West Coast of Scotland and challenged the King of Scotland for power.
Lacedaemonian said:
Orthandor, I am impressed with your interest in my countries history mate. The Welsh, the Scottish and the Irish were countries which were well and truly conquered by England. Wales, Scotland and part of Ireland still belongs to England, we harvest their taxes and spend those taxes in London and the SE of England. Just like the good old days.
Quite a nationalistic view of history, although rather untrue. While the Welsh were indeed 'well and truly conquered' and ceased technically even to be a seperate nation, instead becoming a principality of England, and the Irish were gradually colonised Scotland was never conquered by England. Indeed seeing as the union of crowns which led to the formation of the United Kingdom came about as a result of the English crown being handed to the King of Scotland if you were to make any allusions to a nation being conquered it would be England ;) . Spot on regarding the taxes though.