100 Greatest Britons

Connavar

Connavar

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100 Greatest Britons was broadcast in 2002 by the BBC. The programme was based on a television poll conducted to determine whom the United Kingdom public considered the greatest British people in history.

You guys must have seen this programme or remember when this poll happened. I was wondering seriously what you guys think of the top 10 in the list? Do you agree or disagree?

Also make your own Top 10 greatest britons ever in your own eyes. Of course there can be Irish persons too like some of the ones that made the original 100 list. The point of this thread is not to debate popular vote or what is "britishness" but to hail some of the great historical persons.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/100_Greatest_Britons
 
From my distant memories of the program, my feeling was that the order that was given was partially down to the advocates and recent history at the time. Basically Jeremy Clarkson argued for Brunel, and I think the force of his gigantic personality (and head) swayed a lot of petrol heads to vote for him. Brunel is a great Briton but he's not 2nd in my list at all. Also Diana, Princess of Wales, had just died five years before and was still in many's memories - I think if the poll was to be re-run she would drop down.

I think I actually did vote - for Isaac Newton (but then I would as I'm a Physicist by training :)) Then Darwin would move up too.

I would disagree with Winston Churchill at the top - because he was a complex man. Yes he was exactly what the country needed to fight off Hitler, but then he was also an ardent imperialist and old-fashioned (the electorate saw that in the polls in 1945*) Was the one of those responsible for the disaster at Gallipoli as well as a catalogue of other ills.

Shakespeare goes without saying - but oddly I'd also stick with Elizabeth I up there (oddly, because she was never my queen! My [unofficial**] Elizabeth the first is still on the throne today :D ) but she was the first successful English queen and had a great deal of power and success in very trying times.




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* and I should point out he lost again in 1950, although to be fair to him 20 months later he got back in!
** I know, I know the numbering rules are for whatever leads on from the highest king/queen either side of the border...
 
Pretty nutty list.
Half of them could be replaced by far more worthy people.
Seems to be more a vox populi "who can you remember" list.
Some were not "great" at all.
 
Diana and Lennon were dramatically overrated. Alfred the Great should be on that list, perhaps likewise Edward III.

I like history but I'm not that into modern history (I prefer Roman stuff, by and large) so I don't feel that qualified to comment much further.
 
Venusian Broon said:
From my distant memories of the program, my feeling was that the order that was given was partially down to the advocates and recent history at the time. Basically Jeremy Clarkson argued for Brunel, and I think the force of his gigantic personality (and head) swayed a lot of petrol heads to vote for him. Brunel is a great Briton but he's not 2nd in my list at all. Also Diana, Princess of Wales, had just died five years before and was still in many's memories - I think if the poll was to be re-run she would drop down.

I think I actually did vote - for Isaac Newton (but then I would as I'm a Physicist by training :)) Then Darwin would move up too.

I would disagree with Winston Churchill at the top - because he was a complex man. Yes he was exactly what the country needed to fight off Hitler, but then he was also an ardent imperialist and old-fashioned (the electorate saw that in the polls in 1945*) Was the one of those responsible for the disaster at Gallipoli as well as a catalogue of other ills.

Shakespeare goes without saying - but oddly I'd also stick with Elizabeth I up there (oddly, because she was never my queen! My [unofficial**] Elizabeth the first is still on the throne today :D ) but she was the first successful English queen and had a great deal of power and success in very trying times.




-------------------------------------------------------------------
* and I should point out he lost again in 1950, although to be fair to him 20 months later he got back in!
** I know, I know the numbering rules are for whatever leads on from the highest king/queen either side of the border...
Click to expand...


I respect Diana for her charity work and like you said her tragic death few years before the vote helped her cause. She has nothing to do with a top 10 list of greatest britons with the likes legendary people in the history of mankind like Shakespeare,Elizabeth I, Sir Isaac Newton,Darwin.

Churchil was important for WWII but he was after all a minister who lost, one of the people who created the modern borders for nations in the middle east and one of the reasons for the mess today. I agree he would not top the list as nr.1 for me either. A smart politician comes and goes often but legendary Queens who changed her nations history, greatest playright in history, Newton and Darwin is more greater in my eyes. He is a given in top 5-10 but not nr. 1 imo.

How would your top 10 look? I would keep from that top 10 list Shakespeare, Elizabeth I,Newton,Darwin,Churchill. Lennon,Diana, Brunel would not be in my top 10.
 
Ray McCarthy said:
Pretty nutty list.
Half of them could be replaced by far more worthy people.
Seems to be more a vox populi "who can you remember" list.
Some were not "great" at all.
Click to expand...

Some were not great? You mean in the top 10 list or the 100 list in general? Who would you remove from the top 10? Create your own top 10 just to see who is more worthy in your eyes.
 
Using the top 100 (I don't have the energy to think up any new ones!)

  1. Sir Isaac Newton
  2. Charles Darwin
  3. William Shakespeare
  4. Emmeline Pankhurst
  5. Sir Winston Churchill
  6. James Clerk Maxwell
  7. Florence Nightingale
  8. Michael Faraday
  9. Arthur Wellesley, 1st Duke of Wellington
  10. Elizabeth I

Would be my first personal stab at it. As you can see I'm more of a science-leaning person when it comes to greats!
 
Oh no ... I'm not going there.

First you need to define "Great" anyway.
Does it make sense to have Celebrities, "Culture" (in widest sense), Engineering, Science, Economics, Politics, Entrepreneurs, Empire builders, Military, etc top people in the same top 10 and top 100 at all?

No it's nonsense to compare Politicians with Scientists. You need different categories, even if you do have a sensible definition of great.

How can a Pop star (no matter how good) be compared to discoverer of Antibiotics, Cecil Rhodes, Designer of London Sewers, developer of Modern Machine tools (Babbage, also groundbreaking book on Economics), Alan Blumlein, Brunell, QU I, leaders of Suffragettes etc etc?
 
Ray McCarthy said:
Oh no ... I'm not going there.

First you need to define "Great" anyway.
Does it make sense to have Celebrities, "Culture" (in widest sense), Engineering, Science, Economics, Politics, Entrepreneurs, Empire builders, Military, etc top people in the same top 10 and top 100 at all?
Click to expand...

I totally agree...but it's a bit of flim-flam fun to debate these problems as well :)

I mean David Beckham came in at number 33.

David-feckin'-Beckham. A haircut that can kick a ball well, who married a pop star that could barely hold a note (unless they were a wad of tenners), is the thirty-third greatest Briton in all history (as of 2002)

Not with me.

But the original program did it with a vote, so it's popular democracy in action.
 
Venusian Broon said:
I'm more of a science-leaning person when it comes to greats
Click to expand...
Plenty of those are not Scientists.
Since about 1500; Science, Mathematics, Engineering have been perhaps the most important areas anyway. Then Businessmen with the vision to invest in the technology. Then Writers, Politicians, Artists and Architects then maybe Military people.
People campaigning for rights etc (Women Votes, children in Mines & Chimneys) don't fit into the grades of importance.

How do you decide if Lord Kelvin, Churchill, Pankhurst, Fleming, Babbage* or Shakespeare is greater in "Greatness" rank? It's impossible. They are in such different areas.

The most important or Great "Britons" in last 500 or 600 years in many cases are not even known to most of the public.

[*Babbage (and Lovelace) while famous for Mechanical computer, his main lasting greatness was advancing UK to world leader in Machine Tools and his book on Economics and Industrialisation. Most people have never even heard of Alan Blumlein, perhaps the most important engineer in UK from 1924 till 1942. Or Tommy Flowers who helped win WWII]
 
George Graham Inventor /clockmaker . Among the the thing he came up with . He invented the deadbeat escapement for clocks. This is significant because it resulted in more accurate timepieces.

John Harrison inventor of the practical Marine chronometer.

Thomas Tompion clockmaker/watchmaker and master engraver, he was a great craftsman, one of the greatest of all time. His clocks and watches and engravings are among the finest ever made.
 
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My top 10 would be:
  1. Henry VIII
  2. Sir Isaac Newton
  3. John Locke
  4. Shakespeare
  5. Sir Francis Bacon
  6. Charles Darwin
  7. Elizabeth I
  8. Anselm of Canterbury
  9. Jeremy Bentham
  10. Lord Kelvin
 
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A philosophical list [I have vague memories of Bentham, and even vaguer of Anselm, from school]. Mildly surprised Henry VII's top dog. What made you pick him?
 
Thought He affected history the most, Henry VIII it should be, with his Protestant Reformation, and taking on the Papacy. He had a gut to do that, and take on some powerful Catholic nobles
 
Sir Richard Burton

Charles James Fox
 
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Alexander Fleming the man who came up with Penicillin
 
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