Is it a bad idea to use un-linguistic-ly sound names in fantasy.

[sknox]

>My only stipulation is that I want names that are easy to pronounce
It's worth keeping in mind, though, that what one person finds easy to pronounce, another finds nearly impossible. The example that comes to mind is War and Peace. Many people have trouble navigating those Russian names, especially in their rather convoluted 19th century form. But I imagine a 19thc Russian had no trouble with them at all.

I find German easy to pronounce, but I've met others who think it's terribly difficult to work through German terms and phrases. Dutch can be even more of a challenge, except to the Dutch.

Extending that logic, I imagine the author of every "unpronounceable" fantasy name finds their invented names easy to pronounce. So I try to believe, when I struggle with a book, that the fault lies primarily with me. I am not always successful in convincing myself of that.

 

[paranoid marvin]

I like Charles Dickens' style. You pretty much know everything you need to about a character by their name.

 

[hitmouse]

Speaking as a reader and not an author, I find using un-linguistic names to be fine. For me it makes the character more real-to-life. Our names are our names, (I live in a Dutch immigrant enclave, and we have names like Van Der Meulen, which we use. We don't say Joe "from the windmill." But if we are talking about a windmill it is not a Meulen) but I do not care if an author puts much more than that in the alien language. Even if the story arose from an alien telling, for me to be able to read it, the story has to be translated/written in English.

It is interesting to compare real- world experience, isn’t it? I live in Wales, where there are about 12 very common surnames, and nicknames are generally used to differentiate people: Jones the Butcher, Edwards the post, Big Sian, Mad Sian, Dai AI, Dai Dwr, Dai sh*t, Dai Station, Evans Twp, Roberts the sled, etc.

 

[Pyan]

.Bottom line: pretentious unpronounceable names annoy the hell out of me and, in extreme case, might stop me from returning to that author.

This.
My personal extreme dislike is the intrusive apostrophe in proper names, apart (of course) for Lovecraft. There's some almost unreadable passages by Anne McCaffrey, due to the lists of apostrophied dragonriders.

 

[Teresa Edgerton]

I live in Wales, where there are about 12 very common surnames, and nicknames are generally used to differentiate people: Jones the Butcher, Edwards the post, Big Sian, Mad Sian, Dai AI, Dai Dwr, Dai sh*t, Dai Station, Evans Twp, Roberts the sled, etc.

It would be the same in a medieval village, in England and possibly elsewhere, except that it would be a handful of first names, so that patronymics, sobriquets, diminutives, references to occupation or place of residence, etc. would become a part of a person's identity.

So to take (and expand on) Junk Monkey's example of a meeting, it might actually go something like this:

"Good day to you, Bob son of Rob. I hope I see you well."

"Very well, Robin Fletcher. What do you hear from our cousin?"

"Would that be Robert the Tall or Robert the Small?"

"Neither. I was thinking of our cousin William."

"William the Bald, or Willie the Mad?"

"Will-with-the-limp."

(Growing impatient with this tedious interchange.) "Ask him yourself. He's right over there. Good day to you!"
____

Modern readers would of course be up in arms if several characters had the same first name, no matter how authentic that might be.

 

[hitmouse]

It would be the same in a medieval village, in England and possibly elsewhere, except that it would be a handful of first names, so that patronymics, sobriquets, diminutives, references to occupation or place of residence, etc. would become a part of a person's identity.

So to take (and expand on) Junk Monkey's example of a meeting, it might actually go something like this:

"Good day to you, Bob son of Rob. I hope I see you well."

"Very well, Robin Fletcher. What do you hear from our cousin?"

"Would that be Robert the Tall or Robert the Small?"

"Neither. I was thinking of our cousin William."

"William the bald, or Willie the mad?"

"Will-with-the-limp."

(Growing impatient with this tedious interchange.) "Ask him yourself. He's right over there. Good day to you!"
____

Modern readers would of course be up in arms if several characters had the same first name, no matter how authentic that might be.

I remember becoming progressively incredulous and exasperated when reading One Hundred Years of Solitude by Gabriel Garcia Marquez. A multigenerational family saga, where the males are mostly named Jose or Aureliano. A terrific book, but quite confusing.

 

[The Big Peat]

I have definitely advised authors to make sure their names don't seem familiar while at the same time now yearning to do exactly that sort of 100 Years of Solitude thing.

Incidentally, if we needed any more confirmation about what Teresa said about it being fine if you write a captivating story, the fact we are here grumbling about naming conventions in wildly successful books says it all.

 

[Danny McG]

Modern readers would of course be up in arms if several characters had the same first name

I'm like that with a TV series if two characters have similar names... I even get annoyed if there's like two men with dark hair (that's in a similar style) "Wait! What the? Which one is that supposed to be?"

 

[Teresa Edgerton]

I even get annoyed if there's like two men with dark hair (that's in a similar style) "Wait! What the? Which one is that supposed to be?"

Yes, it happens to me, too. Not when I was younger, but it's crept up on me with old age. And confusing people's names, even (or especially) family members. Why didn't I think ahead and name all my children, "Hey, you there!"

 

[Parson]

Yes, it happens to me, too. Not when I was younger, but it's crept up on me with old age. And confusing people's names, even (or especially) family members. Why didn't I think ahead and name all my children, "Hey, you there!"

As we are of a similar age I resonate with this. But, worse, I was never very good with names (A serious handicap for a Parson!). And more than this I am now really struggling with movies to recognize a character from earlier in the show. I'll often say to my wife something like "Is that the one who got the wrong baby in the hospital?" And don't get me started on recognizing which of the wait staff was "our's."

 

[AnRoinnUltra]

Going back to the OP I think it's a good idea in live fantasy storytelling. Totally anecdotal but I've noticed that the more outlandish the names, the more they seem to register with listeners. Might be worth bearing in mind when writing for audio drama.

 

[Astro Pen]

I'm with @Vertigo
As soon as a book starts with ridiculous unpronounceable names like Thrrl or M'Pwwl of the K-Niml I drop it like a stone.
Luckily this kind of thing is evident in the bookshop, and the book can be re-slotted, brick like, in the wall of the unpurchased.
Now I understand that, 'Kevin the Venusian' isn't going to work either but I would like to see names that are pronounceable enough to not grate and pull me out of the story. Graf, Geo or Zeno for example.

 

[paranoid marvin]

There are times when a reader may find a name or place difficult to pronounce, but this should only be when anything easier to read out would be inappropriate.

There are (apparently) 8.7 million species of animals on our planet. Only one of them (as far as we know) names each individual in its species. The rest use sight, sound, smell to identify each other.

The likelihood is that any alien doesn't even have a name, let alone one created from the outer reaches of the English alphabet.

 

[Teresa Edgerton]

The likelihood is that any alien doesn't even have a name, let alone one created from the outer reaches of the English alphabet.

Good point! (Though once humans get involved with them, no doubt they would acquire nicknames. Or verbal translations of their, um, un-names. Smells-Like-Mildew, or Broken-Glass-Crunching-Underfoot, for instance.)

 

[psychotick]

Hi,

Yeah for me it's mostly about having names that are easily pronounceable (in my head). Names that I can associate with each character and not get confused with others.

And yeah, like others I have the same problems with faces in telly shows. I think the worst recently was the Magicians - the first season. I mean how many young women can you have with the same damned hair style and coloring?! Damn I was so confused! Later on they started altering appearances - someone must have heard my screams of frustration!

Cheers, Greg.

 

[msstice]

I'm reading a fantasy book to my daughter where some of the people's names are unpronouncable and some seem to have been thought up by a marketing team. The writer had the sense to make the unpronouncable names be that of minor evil characters.

Anytime I'm giggling or stumbling when I'm reading a name, it had better be intentional, otherwise it'll just ruin the story.

One tricky thing is non-English names. I had a colleague whose first name was spelled "Semen". We were taught to pronounce it "Simon" but I don't think you could easily put that in a book.

In short, as far as possible, make names distinct and make them roll off (English) tongues, assuming you are writing in English.

 

[Vertigo]

The rest use sight, sound, smell to identify each other.

My understanding is that we largely degraded our senses in favour of using the brain capacity for...well...intelligence. it's also one of the arguments for domesticated dogs' contribution to the development of our intelligence, as they provided these 'lost' senses for us. It seems likely that alien intelligences might have followed a similar path.

 

[Elckerlyc]

I read loads of books that aren't written in my own language. It is not uncommon for me to encounter foreign names. Often I haven't a clue how to proper pronounce them. But I don't think it matters. The author won't drop by anytime soon to sternly correct my unintended maiming of a character's name.
You, as a reader, have to accept that not every name - be it foreign or made-up - is written to especially suit your tongue. As a writer you may dream your work will be translated in a dozen different languages, where people may be struggling with the names (likely normal, well-known, proper English names - or, help me! - Welsh names) you have burdened your characters with.
A Russian novel with contain Russian names. Of course it does. I wouldn't dream of discarding that book just because it has names I can't pronounce. Nor do I need to, I can substitute them with a more Western version, or whatever, in my mind.
A writer who writes about aliens with really unpronounceable names, so it looks authentic alien, has made that choice for a reason. Not to your liking perhaps. But I think you do their work an injustice by discarding it for its 'pretentious' name-giving. You don't have to pronounce the offending names.
We do not all speak English. And aliens least of all. Nor are foreign names pretentious.

 

[Parson]

My understanding is that we largely degraded our senses in favour of using the brain capacity for...well...intelligence. it's also one of the arguments for domesticated dogs' contribution to the development of our intelligence, as they provided these 'lost' senses for us. It seems likely that alien intelligences might have followed a similar path.

I was surprised to learn that the human nose is about right in the middle of the pack for the sense of smell among animals. Dogs are near the top of this continuum. The article declared (I don't have independent confirmation) that if the average human concentrated well enough they could sometimes follow a scent trail. If that's true, I'm not sure how much our senses have degraded. I suspect that we have ways of finding and tracking today that are easier and so don't usually use what we have.

It is often said that blind people increase their abilities with their other senses. Scientists have tested this theory out and find it false. What they find to be true is that blind people pay more attention to their other senses, since they don't have any visual input.

 

[Fiberglass Cyborg]

I rather like how Tad Williams handles names in "Memory, Sorrow and Thorn." We start out with people who have, ordinary, boring English names like "Simon." Cultures further from home have names that are slightly more unfamiliar but still vaguely European-sounding - "Camaris," "Eolair." Extremely distant and / or non-human cultures have names that the Simons of the world find a bit of a mouthful, like "Jiriki i-Sa'onserei" and "Sisquinanamook." But if these characters are going to crop up a lot, Williams makes sure these names have a less cumbersome short form: "Jiriki", "Sisqui".

Another set of names I like are the Alethi and Veden names from "The Stormlight Archive." They're pretty easy to guess a pronounciation for, but they are not obvious real-world transplants and they have a certain linguistic consistancy. "Adolin," "Renarin", "Dalinar," "Shallan," "Jasnah" - you can already get a feel for how names work in that culture.