Game of Thrones: 8.05 - The Bells

grip junky

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Going all the way back to the books I thought, if the boy who thought he was a bastard nobody but is a prince becomes king how cliché would that be. I hear GRRM is super original so I hope that is not how it goes.
 

Koopa

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in some ways, i think grrm actually intends to follow the classic hero patterns. He just wants to hide that pattern amidst the jungle of other stuff.
 

Judderman

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I can't remember what that film is called, but the young actor does look vaguely similar to Emilia Clarke.
 

L.L.Lotte

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My response: read the books when they come out...


Of course, those of them that read books will read them, and then the same thing will happen, and then they'll have to demand GRRM rewrite his books, and then he will be, "No way in hell is that happening."

I really, really can't see why everyone is getting so out of shape about it all. It's like Luke Skywalker all over again... (another one I liked and others hated. I must be easily pleased.)
I think people just wanted to love Daenerys. And now they can't....

She was their Khaleesi, a favorite character on the show for many people because she was young, female, pretty, mistreated, and started off with good ideals and purpose. Why else would parents be naming their children after her? I suspect they let that influence their perspective on her and missed what was coming. I'm not saying the show did it well, because they didn't. The books will do better. Just saying, I can understand why people are reacting the way they are.

I already suspected that it would turn out this way before this season. Even before she landed in the Seven Kingdoms, I had come to the conclusion that she wouldn't be the good leader everybody hoped for. And when she burned the Tullys alive, I knew she would end up being a tyrant like her father. And then there was Varys, who'd been with her from the start, the person who had set her on this path...

So the show did put the foreshadowing in there. It was just so much more obvious this season because they had to go to an extreme of breaking her to make those who had missed those clues realize the same. It was probably too much of an extreme...

I do feel that razing Kings Landing to the ground was going too far, but the idea of burning of Kings Landing was mentioned a few times before it actually happened. And Tyrion telling her to listen for the bells, and her ignoring him in response; that was more than evidence enough to me that she wasn't going to leave anybody alive in the city, regardless of their surrender. The show couldn't have made it any clearer what was going to happen...

it wasn't a surprise to me.

The point on which I have to question the coherence isn't actually Dany though, but the whole defeat of the Night King/the Long Night/Prince That Was Promised etc.etc. That was a huge focus of the show, it was Westageddon, it was Chekhov's rocket launcher... and then it fired and a little paper flag saying "Bang!" appeared out of the end. I'm still not sure who The Prince That Was Promised actually is. Arya? I just googled whether she was and I'm seeing a theory that she is and will show it in the next episode... that's a hell of a twist if correct. I'm not sure if that'll be coherent. To not have a coherent ending to such a major plot strand is pretty weak.
I'm assuming that would have to connect Bran to another theory.

That he is actually a time traveling Bran the Builder and ultimately became the Night King. If that is true, then it would make sense that Arya becomes Azar Ahai, because she killed a loved one when she killed the Night King (Bran).

But...

My thought was that when they killed off Milisandre, they intentionally ended that plotline unfulfilled. I feel like the direction that the show took with the whole Prince That Was Promised / R'hllor was one of disaster and hopelessness. Obviously she did have powers, and those powers had to come from somewhere, but time and again, she failed to achieve her goals and was mistaken about a lot of things. She even had to kill herself when the dead failed to do so. She wanted to die, which is something I feel she wouldn't have done if there was a chance the prophecy could still come true.

All we can do is wait and see what happens next week.

I can't remember what that film is called,
I hope that's sarcasm... :LOL:
 

Judderman

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Oh and as well as wondering about Vary's letter and Dorne, along with Bronn, is Bran going to do something next episode? I watched a film called Apostle recently. Maybe he will have a similar end to the main character.
 

svalbard

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Oh and as well as wondering about Vary's letter and Dorne, along with Bronn, is Bran going to do something next episode? I watched a film called Apostle recently. Maybe he will have a similar end to the main character.
I have a theory that they have held back on Bran and a deeper explanation on the Night King and the White Walkers so that they can explore them in the prequels.
 

Culhwch

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It's not the criticism that bothers me, so much as the entitlement to have it changed/redone. I grew up with two series - Alien and Star Wars - that have produced weak or just downright bad films. The bad films were let-downs, definitely, but I don't feel angry about Alien 3 or The Phantom Menace. I just think they're a bit poor. Even the killing of REDACTED (;)), which strikes me as a cheap and nasty trick, doesn't bother me in that way. I was all for the cancelled sequel that would have brought them back to life, but the fact that it's not going to happen just seems rather a shame.
The big difference between those two films and GoT though is the world into which they were released. The internet culture has created an entire industry of content about other content, and it's massive and very pervasive. Just have a casual scroll through YouTube, and you see endless videos about GoT, Endgame, this TV show, that movie. And then there's Twitter and Facebook, of course.

When Alien 3 came out, you might have read a review in a paper or a magazine, maybe saw something about it on TV, but other than your immediate circle of friends, there weren't many people to talk about it with. The Phantom Menace came out just as the internet as we know it was picking up steam, so it had a little bit of what you see today (though from memory a lot of the real dissection was more delayed). But now there is this great big echo chamber into which people can shout whatever opinion they have - and if others have the same opinion, it can really pick up steam. And it's become a lucrative industry for YouTube content creators to seize on the popular opinion and pile on. I'm not saying that they're wrong or right - just that they're a lot louder than they used to be...

Oh and as well as wondering about Vary's letter...
Me too! That has to play a part, right? My thought was that he was sending them en masse to all the lords of Westeros, who will roll up at whatever kind of coronation Dany holds (thrones of charred skulls, mebbe?) and be all like, 'Yo, we'd rather Jon.'
 

L.L.Lotte

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Me too! That has to play a part, right? My thought was that he was sending them en masse to all the lords of Westeros, who will roll up at whatever kind of coronation Dany holds (thrones of charred skulls, mebbe?) and be all like, 'Yo, we'd rather Jon.'
Yes, the letters can't have been shown twice for nothing.... Jon will need more allies for when he turns against Daenerys -- unless he is dead, in which case for when the North turns against Daenerys...

Dorne at least needs to make an appearance -- although I fear that the brief mention in passing we got about them might be all there is of that nation...
 

picklematrix

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I would gave preffered Rhaegal to die in this episode. That would make it less one sided and give better motivation for Danys rampage.
Assuming Dany can be prevented from holding tyrranical power, Westeros needs some sort of Magna Carta. A shame Varys can't help with writing it. I wouldn't trust Tyrion or Jon to get things right!
 
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Toby Frost

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P.S. @Toby Frost maybe some spoiler tags next time, this isn't a thread about those movies after all.
Sorry, you're absolutely right. I assumed that since it's such an old film it didn't matter. Apologies about that. I can't edit the post now, but if the mods would like to, please do.
 

Jax

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The thing with the letter I took a different way. The first time he is interupted while writing it. The second time they show it, he seems to finish it but burns it in a pot on his desk.
It wasn't very clear, but I think that was him changing his mind.......and then Tyrion betrays him anyway
 

Al Jackson

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I would gave preffered Rhaegal to die in this episode. That would make it less one sided and give better motivation for Danys rampage.
Assuming Dany can be prevented from holding tyrranical power, Westeros needs some sort of Magna Carta. A shame Varys can't help with writing it. I wouldn't trust Tyrion or Jon to get things right!
Someone suggested that Rhaegal scenario , especially if it had come at the ringing of the bells, then Tyrion would have had a terrible quandary and that would have been cool. They missed a beat there.
 
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