Star Trek - Discovery - 2.14: Such Sweet Sorrow, part 2

BAYLOR

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I enjoyed Worm Hole Extreme and 200 as an interesting meta experience. A lot like the strange episodes on Supernatural.


I liked the finale and were the show ended up. Jumping the ship forward past any of the other shows does away with many issues. I wonder about Georgiou because she was on Discovery but she's getting her own show in the past.

Just because I have watched Star Trek all my life and have enjoyed all the TV shows including Enterprise, doesn't mean I have to like everything they do.



Many Stargate fans complain about Universe and more about the recent 10 part web series. Doctor Who fans do it all the time. Even more than normal this last year. DC fans were upset about Legends and some more about Supergirl. There's been a steady outcry from DC comic fans about Arrow stealing Batman's plotlines and Supergirl stealing Superman's.

I could go on and I bet I could even find that NCIS complaint.
Im kidding about both WormHole extreme and Episode 200. I loved both those wonderfully twisted episodes :D
 

Cathbad

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I'm just saying I couldn't call myself a fan of something I feel the need to complain about all the time.

I realize fans are going to complain about specific things/episodes - I do it myself! But it is very hard to find a ST or SW forum where everyone is NOT ripping everything and anything ST/SW. Most seem to be Group Commiseration Conventions!
 

Cathbad

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Here's a challenge: Everyone say one good thing about this Discovery season without adding anything negative. Can you do it?
 

ctg

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Terran Georgiou is the best Star Trek villain in any series or film. (Even Khan.)
I never really liked Khan. I liked the Borg Queen and I really like the Emperor Georgiou. But I still don't know what is her deal with Michael and why she's so obsessed about her, after they travelled to the Prime Universe. And I thought she would have given tougher opponent to Source Leland.

I also like Romulans and I believe there's more to the story then we have been let to know. Their galactic empire rivals the United Federation of Planets. Yet, they are still a bigger puzzle than Andorians or Klingons.
 

Alexa

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I believe Georgiou cannot look at Michael other than her own daughter. It was interesting to watch her when they met Michael's real mother in this dimension.

Anyone noted Pike's wink to Georgiou when she told him she was from an alternate reality ?
 

BAYLOR

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Here's a challenge: Everyone say one good thing about this Discovery season without adding anything negative. Can you do it?
The openings title sequences in season 2 are a distinct improvement over seasons one.:whistle:

Baylor quickly logs of and runs out the room before Cathbad noises the above comment. :p
 

Anthoney

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Here's a challenge: Everyone say one good thing about this Discovery season without adding anything negative. Can you do it?
Anson Mount did a great job as Pike. I enjoyed the whole Pike storyline. I found the bearded Spock interesting. I liked it more each time I saw it. It made for a dramatic moment when he finally showed up clean shaven. Pretty much all of the Georgiou scenes and dialog were really good. "I thought there were no bad ideas?" There were several great hand to hand combat scenes. The new klingon D7 looked just like it was supposed to.

The battle at the end was like a scenario from the game Star Fleet Battles, which is cool.

Several things I liked.
 

BAYLOR

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Gots me a tear in me eye... e'en @BAYLOR made an effort to say something good about the series! ;)

Season 2 all things considered ,was pretty damned good . Anson Mount was terrific in the role of Pike , Much of what they did worked . Its just they way the resolved Discovery , hit me the wrong way . It's a bit of a stretch , but then again it was probably the best solution to the cannon dilemma .

And for the record , I still want a Captain Pike tv series. And im not alone on that one.
 

Alexa

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It was a good finish. They have conveniently tried to wrap up the continuity that doesn't bother you, but obviously bothers a lot of people they are trying to please. I knew that Spock was staying once he went into the shuttle, just as I knew that the Admiral would be the one to die once she looked way too long at the manual door closer.

So, we were correct about the identity of the Red Angel after all.

I have a few observations/questions. Maybe it is just that I missed something myself. First, I thought that this would have made one of the best endings to a Star Trek series ever, if there was to be no Season 3. Secondly, Season 3 will be very different indeed, and I can now see why some fans are saying that they would rather see a Captain Pike series instead, or as well.

3. With "Control dead and Leland neutralised," why did Discovery still need to go to the future? I understand that history said that it did, but then does history say that Vulcan is destroyed, or does it say that Spock reunifies Vulcan and Romulus? History in Star Trek is not a fixed thing. Now maybe, they were still unsure if Control was completely dead and Leland was totally neutralised, or maybe they thought that the mere presence of the Sphere data in the present day would effect the same problem to arise all over again. In other words, the existence of the Sphere data is just too dangerous to exist in itself, and therefore Discovery must be taken out of the equation. In that case, why make the "Red signal" drawing them to the asteroid, why not leave it undiscovered? Much easier not to do something, than correct all of the problems caused by doing it. There is a complex time paradox there, and I don't think they got it logically correct.

4. Discovery is going to the future with only a skeleton crew aboard. If no one knows about her in the future then she is going to be a big surprise. The Spore Drive and the Sphere Data are all going to be interesting, but the ship itself will go to a museum. if it needs a certain number of people to operate it, then they can't go off themselves without taking aboard more personnel. I'm interested to know how that is going to work out. However, I'm also unclear how none of the Discovery crew that left her never talked about her, or wrote secret memoirs, or a bestselling tell-all book later in their lives. That takes some discipline, but no missed records exist at all? Totally wiped clean from the history books and Michael Burnham never existed? This part, I cannot believe. The Section 31 being toned down, I can.

5. Michael Burnham never existing is interesting because now, the animated episode where Spock returns to the past (Yesteryear TAS) to help his young self from being attacked in the Vulcan desert, now actually makes more sense too.
I believe nobody addressed your main comments Dave. I will try to dit, but not particularly in order. I watched the episode again yesterday, as just like you, I had a lot of questions.

We can thank Spock why nobody never talked about Discovery and Michael. Just at the end of the episode, Spock proposed a directive ( I didn't have the time to note it down) and asked that all those who dared to talked about them, be immediately condamned with treason charges. Honestly, I don't know why, since we already know the 3rd season is coming back next year. Unless, they plan the next season into an alternate reality.

Section 31 toned town with Tyler in charge ? Hmm. No way !

Leland was neutralised. This doesn't mean Control is dead. After all Leland was just another vessel and gave voice to Control. Maybe Control version was the ancester of the Borgs ?

With all this mix of past, present and future, plus alternative reality who can understand what's going on logically ? Not even Spock. So just like they say, let's called it just an act of faith. ;)
 
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Anthoney

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We can thank Spock why nobody never talked about Discovery and Michael. Just at the end of the episode, Spock proposed a directive ( I didn't have the time to note it down) and asked that all those who dared to talked about them, be immediately condamned with treason charges.
Like Moses their names were stricken from all the temples and forbidden to be spoken of again.
 

nixie

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I love discovery, don't have any negative thoughts. The battle had me glued to the screen. Agree Georgeou is the best villain.

I like all the trek shows including Enterprise.
If I had to list them

1. Discovery
2. TNG
3. Voyager
4. DS9
5. The Orignal
6. Enterprise.

I don't see why Captain Pike can't have his own series as well as a third Discovery, the franchise is big enough to support more than one series, if The Walking Dead can do it so can they.
It does seem a growing trend to pick out the negatives in shows instead of the positive.
 

Narkalui

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That was a satisfying conclusion. I liked Georgiou's moment of triumph over Control and it was sad to see Admiral Cornwell go.

Sorry to be a winger (as in a person having a winge) but I though the battle was a bit over long, towards the end I found myself wanting to shout "Get on with it!"
 
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