Monetising your writing

[Jo Zebedee]

I wondered if this would be a good thing to talk about. Obviously we all hope to become best sellers and not have to worry about such boring things as external income, but the reality is most of us won't. I certainly haven't. (well, there was that one day when I knocked Star Wars off number one in Space Opera....)

Anyhow, I thought it might be a good idea to know what works and where possible revenue sources lie. I hoped others might chime in - maybe any copy or content writers out there? that sort of thing?

I make about a quarter of my (hardly high-living) income from writing and related activities. I still do too many for free but this week I had to, for the first time, turn down writing-related work as I have too much in the diary (and do actually want to see my family at some point). This, then, is where I get additional earning from writing:

1. Delivering courses. I work for a local arts centre (the main one in Belfast) delivering a course on writing sff. I'm a trainer as part of my day job (I wear many, many hats) so it made sense to expand that. I do 2 hours a week, on a Thursday evening, and earn FE college wages.
2. Delivering workshops. I also do one day (or weekend) workshops. I've been in Dubin this year, as well as Belfast and all around Northern Ireland. I do them for writing groups, for voluntary groups, and think I might be doing some school work this year. All around the same fee as above.
3. Book festivals. Not the easiest to get into as a sff writer, but if you're halfway entertaining/knowledgeable (who knows why they hire me, then!) you can end up being 'that weird sci fi woman*' and get called upon when the festival realises it needs to throw some genre in there for diversity... Now, they pay well. And they mostly book through contacts. So get out there, drink dodgy fizzy wine at receptions and smooze. I've done a few events this year and have an exciting one lined up that I can't talk about yet openly.
4. Funding. I get funded to write books sometimes. This is something that can grow as reputations do. It's a slow builder but it's lucrative. Last time I got the equivalent of a small advance to write The Wildest Hunt. I'm waiting to hear if I get funded again this year. I'm not sure all arts councils do fund, but there are various bursaries available if you know where to look!

5. Writing content - I don't do this (much) but, for instance, Tor are looking for bloggers to deliver content, and they will pay.

Anyhow, maybe some ideas in there for people. And I'd love to be hit up with any you people have!


*gender optional

 

[Jo Zebedee]

Okay - no responses.

So a different question - if you aren’t seeking to expand writing income (remembering more visibility = more sales), why not?

 

[sknox]

I would like more readers. I realize that translates to more sales, but I'm retired so I'm not primarily concerned about the money.

I *am* trying to get more readers, but it's terrifically difficult. Or I'm lousy at it. Or both.

 

[scarpelius]

Have you tried this Fiverr - Creative Writing ?

 

[TheEndIsNigh]

Okay - no responses.

So a different question - if you aren’t seeking to expand writing income (remembering more visibility = more sales), why not?

Hey Jo: Give us a chance. Some of us have to get a responsible adult to read things to us and enable the child locks etc..

Interesting:- This paid book festival stuff: I've often wondered what panel members get besides a free drink and a coffee in the Green room. (Which in most conventions I've been to is a roped of area with the comfy chairs).

Obviously I can see the main speakers could get a wedge cash, but I didn't realise it might filter down to the ordinary Joe at the end of the table.

Also surprised about the Funding Grants. Is that only for the young dynamic, sparkly and up-coming or can miserable old gits like me get a chunk. I realise actually that I wouldn't stand a chance due to my lack of social skills, but for others who may read this thread it would be interesting.

I do have a friend that lives the life of Riley. He gives lectures on cruise ships (all living expenses included, but no actual payments as far as I know). He can find himself lecturing to the passengers or running courses for three or four days in a one week cruise. He can find himself anywhere in the world, if he wants. I wouldn't be surprised to learn there's a book writing equivalent of what he does.

Writing content. I suppose you've tried short fiction (professional rates as posed in Duotrope's site)
Have you, and if so have you had any success or is it just a time wasting exercise?

To be continued :-

 

[HoopyFrood]

I was recently in talks with someone about ghostwriting a book for them. I was very excited about the prospect -- my own ideas for books dried up a long time ago, but I still love to write, so being given all the content and turning it into a complete package was ideal. I know there are plenty of ghostwriting sites so if you have the credentials you could probably join as one of the writers. It is obviously a massive project to take on, though, so if you have your own writing to concentrate on, perhaps not the best.

I've done freelance content in the past. Some of it can be soul destroying, but with so many people and companies having their own websites, they are always looking for people to fill it with content. I once wrote around 90,000 words in furniture descriptions and it was so tedious, but it provided enough money to stay afloat for a good few months.

I'm not sure how effective the likes of Hubpages and similar sites are these days, but if you have a topic you're especially knowledgeable about and can churn out standard length articles on it, you might be able to build up some income from it (although it might take a few years for it to really start snowballing). Basically you get money from people clicking on the advertisements on your articles, so it's small amounts and you have to rely on your articles being popular, which is why it's better to focus on a niche, or keep an eye on trends and write about things people will be searching for.

 

[Jo Zebedee]

interesting, thanks everyone!

I’m currently self employed - and planning to continue with my RL work, since I think that is preferable to writing 70000 words about furniture (fair dues to you, Hoops!) - but it is a huge balancing act at the moment. But if I was to jack it all in and become a writer then I think ghostwriting would be worth exploring. I can churn words out and I’d prefer it to copy writing I think.

Fiver - I worry about its reputation for quality but it’s definitely a market to look at. I might explore further.

Tein - to clarify. Book festivals pay. Sff conventions do not - in fact, you mostly pay for the privelege to be in a panel! (Occasionally you do get a drink)
In terms of funding - people of all ages get it here. The application is based on a combination of the person - they look for someone with a writing history of some sort and who contributes to the arts - and the project - innovation, challenge of and learning points for the writer.

I might try to gather together some of the various ones in a thread.

Short fiction - pay is low and I use it mostly as a gateway to people finding my longer works.

And I love the idea of cruise ship talking! In a few years my kids would be of just the right age to abandon to sail the world

 

[Mouse]

I get royalties come in (once a month from one publisher and once quarterly from t'other) but they aren't much, although, seeing as I do zero promo as the reviews depressed me so much I gave up, I don't think that's too bad. As for anything else, well, I work and I'm currently renovating a house so I don't have much time to look for making money from my writing other than subbing short stories every now and then.

 

[TheEndIsNigh]

interesting, thanks everyone!


And I love the idea of cruise ship talking! In a few years my kids would be of just the right age to abandon to sail the world

Surely you have grateful parents/brothers/sisters/cousins/aunts/uncles/next door neighbours/The man that lives under the arches near the railway, that would love to raise another generation. Are the workhouses full? Are there no orphanages?

You owe it to yourself.

Plus it will teach them to trust no one.

 

[aThenian]

I know a couple of writers who apparently do OK from ghost-writing. Apparently there is also the benefit of working with very good editors in some cases because the publishing houses give celebrity memoirs etc high priority.

I also know someone who does a lot of teaching of creative writing. The trouble is to go far with that often means having qualificiations, which means borrowing money to take the qualifications, and the pay is not that great at the end of it.

The real problem with both though is that they tend to crowd out the writing you actually want to do.

 

[Joshua Jones]

Well, my full time job is outreach and development for a non-profit, and a significant portion of my job is grant writing. Setting aside the grants for writing books (which I may need to look into), if one can write persuasively and especially if there is a pet cause, writing grant proposals for organizations can be very lucrative, both as a regular job and freelance.

If you are going freelance and you have never done it before, you will probably want to volunteer services for the first few so that you can build a little experience and can quote a success rate. After that, an hourly rate between $25 and $50 will likely get you some paying contracts. After a year or two, assuming you are successful, you can start quoting more like $60-$150/hour, depending on what sort of grants you write and what others in your area charge.

One word of caution, though. Avoid commission based work (as in, making a percentage of what is awarded) like plague infested nazi zombies. Many, if not most funders consider it unethical, so if this arraignment is discovered, it basically negates any chance of the proposal being accepted. What some especially unsavory organizations may do is hire someone into a scheme like this, then when the writer doesn't get anywhere and quits in frustration and resignation regarding their abilities, take the work the writer did as boiler plates (essentially where they copy and paste significant sections into other grant proposals) and laugh all the way to the bank. So, always ask for an hourly or per proposal rate.

 

[Luiglin]

Well I can count on two hands the number of sales I've made. Then again, to balance that up, I've not pushed it, at all.

I think I hit my peak with winning the Judge Dredd Megazine competition. It's been downhill ever since .

Someone I help run a writing class with has just given up his job to become a full time author. He supplements sales with numourous courses for varying ages.

 

[Jo Zebedee]

I’ll be honest - the number of truly full time authors I know is really low. Most are doing copywriting, training, using patreon and delivering content in that, festivals and conventions, ghost or tv/film tie in writing.

I think the question isn’t about whether your writing time gets eaten into or what you choose to have it eaten in with

 

[The Big Peat]

I know a full copywriters and have made tentative moves to getting a foot in the door. The main thing I've discovered is that there's a lot of poorly paid grunt work to get started, you'll deal with some right idiots, and the flexibility isn't all there because you have to keep fulfilling the needs of your main clients/agencies. I don't think that's worth it.

You could try getting into paid journalism. If you write well and have a lot of enthusiastic knowledge, there are a bunch of magazines that pay a little for interviewers/reviewers. I had too much imposter syndrome for that and, well, I think the amounts you get pocket money (a friend who was one of Kerrang's main writers and doing a bunch of stuff earned enough to go down from 5 to 4 days at his PR agency iirc).

Also, that one actually brings some visibility. Nobody reads advertising blurb, finds out who wrote it, then goes to see what else they wrote. But people do follow journalists on twitter, and you can cross-pollinate a little.

Tbh though, my main thoughts from trying to make more money by writing, is that time you spend writing things other than your book as just as much work as time spent not writing your book, with the added wrinkle of it generally not being as well paid as the other methods of not working.

 

[Luiglin]

I think the question isn’t about whether your writing time gets eaten into or what you choose to have it eaten in with

I believe he sees it as part of the whole process - he's way more organised than I am with his writing time.

 

[Jo Zebedee]

I believe he sees it as part of the whole process - he's way more organised than I am with his writing time.

Yes - I see it all as linked

 

[The Big Peat]

5. Writing content - I don't do this (much) but, for instance, Tor are looking for bloggers to deliver content, and they will pay.

This one deserves highlighting because even if it didn't pay, I'd still be strongly considering it for the exposure alone.

 

[AlexH]

A while ago I posted about The Haiku Guys & Gals, who are paid quite a handsome fee to write Haiku for people at events.

During a trip to London earlier this year, I spotted two poets who write a "pay what you want" poem on the spot, and another poet who will perform his poems for you and give you one in an envelope for a voluntary donation. The "donation" aspect was for legal reasons.

 

[sknox]

>the number of truly full time authors I know is really low.

Few people have ever lived wholly off writing novels. In earlier times, authors had land or other stable income. The golden age was from around 1850 to about 2000, a century and a half when the novel writer got additional income from writing for magazines and newspapers, so at least they were still occupied in writing. Now those industries have imploded, and opportunities for supplemental income have never been thinner. This, at a time when competition in the published novel arena has grown a hundred-fold.

Our generation has it tough, for our day jobs still occupy the 40 hours a week that was won over a century ago. It needs to go to 25 or 30 hours a week, which would start to free up enough time to do a serious amount of writing. I don't see that happening for another couple of generations.

It's tough living in a transitional era.

 

[Biskit]

So far, the biggest income I've had from writing was winning the BFS writing competition and I've come to the conclusion that what I have to look forward to is the slow trickle coming in from my ebook sales.

I wouldn't feel comfortable or confident delivering courses or workshops, mostly because I would need to be very sure of what I'm doing for that. Physics, maths, software development, OK; writing, not so much. I think the problem would be very similar trying to find funding to write - how do I convince someone(s) else to put their money on me?

I have looked at content writing, but thus far the only people I've done it for has been for free. I did look at Tor - as @The Big Peat says, it's worth it for the exposure - but found it wasn't for me. Maybe I'll try that one again some day.

I suppose the other issue is that most of the routes to monetise my writing - other than people buying my ebooks - involves doing things I loathe. I think I'd rather be writing things I enjoy writing and see very little money than spend my time slogging away at something I don't enjoy. The whole point of downsizing ten-plus years back was to have that sort of autonomy.