Star Trek Discovery - 1.15 Will You Take My Hand

Cathbad

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#22
We still don't know why the Discovery has no place in the history books of the future.
I think this is a bit unfair. We also never learned the name of the man who turned the simple Federation pin into a communicator/beacon, what scientist wiped out inner ear infections, or the real inventor of glass steel.

In other words, there is a lot of Federation history that has never been revealed. Much of what happened on the Discovery is probably mundane/passe, and classified things (such as the spore drive) wouldn't be openly discussed.

Also, you're not allowing for new ideas, simply because we haven't prior knowledge.
 

Cathbad

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#23
The Captain won't be Christopher Pike (not unless the accident he has with the Delta radiation occurs aboard Discovery) but in any case, their new Captain is being picked up on Vulcan.
I don't understand this? The radiation accident occurred after his time aboard the Enterprise, did it not?
 

Dave

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#25
@BAYLOR is correct. Pike was promoted to Fleet Captain from the Enterprise and when Kirk took over. At this point he is just Captain of the Enterprise. The accident with the Delta rays happened on an old Class J starship with training cadets. One of the baffle plates ruptured. It happened months before The Menagerie story which means it happened well after Kirk took over. There is no room for any retconning there, the timeline is very clear. Spock served with him for exactly eleven years, four months, five days. So, we could see Spock. Which means that they will have to answer the question of why Spock never speaks about Michael.

The only other observation I would make is related to Alex Kurtman's comments in that link, where he says "the show is still called Discovery, the show is not called Enterprise." Actually, this season, right from the first episode, it has been the journey of Michael Burnham, rather than the story of the Discovery. That only slowly changed at some point in the last four episodes. Next season looks like it will be completely dispensed with.
 

Cathbad

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#27
Which means that they will have to answer the question of why Spock never speaks about Michael.
I just do not understand this perceived "duty" of Discovery to explain the timeline. Since Spock never spoke of this sister, why would anything need explaining? What storyline would have been enhanced by acknowledging a sister? He's a Vulcan - 'nuff said.

(Personally, I think he felt both ashamed and jealous of her.)
 
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#29
I just do not understand this perceived "duty" of Discovery to explain the timeline. Since Spock never spoke of this sister, why would anything need explaining? What storyline would have been enhanced by acknowledging a sister? He's a Vulcan - 'nuff said.

(Personally, I think he felt both ashamed and jealous of her.)
Spock never spoke of Sybok until Star Trek V so it's not surprising he doesn't mention Michael! :)

In the book that came out last year, it comes across as both Spock and Michael not really knowing each other so there's little reason for them to mention one or the other in casual conversation.
 

Alexa

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#30
I just do not understand this perceived "duty" of Discovery to explain the timeline. Since Spock never spoke of this sister, why would anything need explaining? What storyline would have been enhanced by acknowledging a sister? He's a Vulcan - 'nuff said.

(Personally, I think he felt both ashamed and jealous of her.)
Because she was human ? He has no reason to be jealous on her.
 

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#31
Spock never spoke of Sybok until Star Trek V so it's not surprising he doesn't mention Michael! :)

In the book that came out last year, it comes across as both Spock and Michael not really knowing each other so there's little reason for them to mention one or the other in casual conversation.
If they meet each other now, when the Enterprise and Discovery meet, then the book is clearly wrong. Yes, I accept that he never spoke about Sybok, nor about the Vulcan Princess who was Sybok's mother. Sarek obviously lead a very complicated life, which was not at all clear from his first appearance in TOS.

A
nswering the part about why Spock never speaks of Michael was mentioned in the link to the Alex Kurtzman interview above. We don't need to know, but surely we would like to know. Otherwise, why bring Enterprise into the story at all?

As for the history. History in the future is clearly very important to people. I could cite lots of examples but I have to leave the house. The models in Picard's Ready Room are one good example.
 
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#32
If they meet each other now, when the Enterprise and Discovery meet, then the book is clearly wrong. Yes, I accept that he never spoke about Sybok, nor about the Vulcan Princess who was Sybok's mother. Sarek obviously lead a very complicated life, which was not at all clear from his first appearance in TOS.

A
nswering the part about why Spock never speaks of Michael was mentioned in the link to the Alex Kurtzman interview above. We don't need to know, but surely we would like to know. Otherwise, why bring Enterprise into the story at all?

As for the history. History in the future is clearly very important to people. I could cite lots of examples but I have to leave the house. The models in Picard's Ready Room are one good example.
The book goes before events in the first episode of Discovery with the Shenzhou and Enterprise meeting, resulting in Spock and Michael having to work together. It's clear in there that it's an awkward relationship with them being aware of the existence of eachother but neither really knows the other. The final episode referenced something that's in the book (and I believe it has happened earlier in the series too) so, while it don't think it is officially canon, it does seem to be 'canon-ish'. it will be interesting to see how Spock and Michael behave towards eachother *if* Spock is on the Enterprise.
 

Cathbad

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#33
Spock should be on board the Enterprise. It could be, though, that, not being a factor in the current storyline, we see very little of him.

I don't believe the Enterprise will be sticking around. Heck - they may be merely delivering someone/something! In which case, we might not see Spock or Pike at all!
 
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#34
Spock should be on board the Enterprise. It could be, though, that, not being a factor in the current storyline, we see very little of him.

I don't believe the Enterprise will be sticking around. Heck - they may be merely delivering someone/something! In which case, we might not see Spock or Pike at all!
I suspect it is going to be something like that - maybe we'll get one character from there that beams over or something but I suspect it won't be Pike or Spock.
 
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#36
Why not Spock ? This is the first time we have the chance to know his family better.
Pure speculation on my part - personally, I'd love to see Captain Pike, Spock, Number One, etc. and all the pilot episode crew interacting with the Discovery crew but I've a feeling that we're just being teased here with the possibilities! I've always wanted more stories with that crew as we only get to see the one story and it would be interesting to get to know the characters more (I think so anyway!).
 

ralphkern

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#37
1. I don't have a problem with them meeting the USS Enterprise; I also thought it would happen sooner or later, however, finishing off the war with the Klingons so quickly didn't seem very probable. I don't think the Klingons would believe L'Rell so readily about her holding a total annihilation device, and in any case you would never get 100% support from every faction. Even if they did, and she did, and the Klingon Houses were united, we know they aren't still united in another 100 years. It's all a little too convenient.

Yeah, a little underwhelming.

2. They are really happy to allow a free unreformed Emperor Georgiou to go off carousing around the galaxy causing any kind of mayhem she likes?

I suspect she might be a reoccuring antagonist.

3. We still don't know why the Spore Drive is never used again in the future.

There is a hint of the danger of the Spore Drive with the Charon. Enough I can see where this point is going.

4. We still don't know why the Discovery has no place in the history books of the future.

I think we have some way to go on that. I'm willing to defer this complaint.

5. Dr. Culber is still dead.

He is, but equally, the writers have said this story isn't over yet. Culber is the closest to the idealism of the Star Fleet we know from the other series. I suspect he is the one who will reign in the scientific excess of Stammets (Point 3). And be the 'angel' on the shoulders of the crew. I hope they do bring him back, but even if they don't, and he stays 'dead' (albeit the actor in the series) then his full importance is still to come forth.

I hope they bring Lorca back somehow. He is one of the best antagonists I've seen in awhile. Supremely competant. Compelling. A natural leader. Charasmatic.

That makes him a huge threat. Him and the Emperor continuing their conflict in the prime universe could be devastating.

As Zachary Quinto cut his teeth on TV series, and he's still new to movies, I hope that makes obtaining him possible.
 

Alexa

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#38
If they cannot find any solution and use the spore drive in a different manner than linked to Stammets, I doubt they will find another volunteer in the future.

Lorca is not coming back (see details in link provided in my post # 18).

History books can be incomplete and inaccurate, depending on those who write them. I personnaly enjoy the novelty of this series.:)
 

Cathbad

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#39
History books can be incomplete and inaccurate, depending on those who write them. I personnaly enjoy the novelty of this series.
Quite true. And although you might find some obscure reference book depicting the crew of the aircraft carrier USS Enterprise (CVN 65), it's highly unlikely to include references to their families, nor any classified data.

And anyone who has had a security clearance knows you don't sit around discussing classified matters for no particular reason - even with others with the proper clearance. That's why I don't find it strange in the least these things haven't been discussed in the future series - I can fully understand and accept that.
 

Cathbad

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#40
That (above) said, I can't help but see a parallel in the spore drive and what the Starfleet ship Pegasus was trying to do.
 

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