Fallout 4 - Consequences?

oganalp

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Although I enjoyed Fallout 4 and spent hours, I still feel the lack of depth is the elephant in the room with Bethesda's version. Pre-Bethesda and the Obsidian ones were good, but when it comes to B's internal writing, there is always something missing. It may be because of ESRB concern, or maybe because Obsidian (and Black Isle) has (had) some of the best writers in the business.

However, words cannot describe the letdown I felt when I saw that Fallout 5 (76) is an online game. I am not a fan of online gaming. Jumping player characters ruining the ambience, weird chat in the chatroom, no roleplaying, etc.

The only MMORPG I had fun with, with all its flaws in community and system, was Ultima Online.
 

thaddeus6th

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Point of order: not interested in buying it myself, but I think 76 is a 'side' game. The next proper Fallout will, I think, be called Fallout 5.

Online RPGs don't interest me either.
 

Rodders

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Sorry for the change of topic.

As a huge fan of Half Life but not a big gamer, would Fallout be something that I'd enjoy?
 

Ihe

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Online RPGs don't interest me either.
Amen.
Good RPGs need ONE gamemaster (the game developer) and a consistent mood. Having to share the world with other players who might not care as much is like having an open-heart surgery being interrupted every other minute by a bunch of bonobos on speed. Ruins the mood and the immersion and everyone dies on the table. Humbug.
 

Overread

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Sorry for the change of topic.

As a huge fan of Half Life but not a big gamer, would Fallout be something that I'd enjoy?

I think you might. The original Fallout 1 and 2 are very retro now and might be hard to get into for a "non-gamer" unless you've fond memories of the earlier days. Fallout Tactics is basically the same gameplay with what I'd consider a nearly more modern setup, still old, but accessible to most and looks good.
Fallout 3 introduced more realtime elements, a masssive boost to graphics and brings back a stronger single character story focus.

I'd say wait for a sale and give it a whirl and see how you find it!

Amen.
Good RPGs need ONE gamemaster (the game developer) and a consistent mood. Having to share the world with other players who might not care as much is like having an open-heart surgery being interrupted every other minute by a bunch of bonobos on speed. Ruins the mood and the immersion and everyone dies on the table. Humbug.

I find that MMO type RPGs tend to have very boring RPG elements. The story delivery is quite simple and flat and a LOT of the game is basically "go here, kill stuff" then rinse and repeat a thousand times to level/item grind. The Fun within an MMO is what you get in interaction between other players; your party team, your guild, competing if the game has Player VS Player etc... This often means that you've got to not only find those of a like mind but also play at set times of the day with them. It requires dedication to stick with it - if you love the gameplay that's easy, but I've never settled on any one game for a long period of time. I'll play for a week or two then jump to something else - which is very bad for MMO type games.
 

Boaz

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@Rodders Now on Steam... Fallout 3 is $10, Fallout 3 GotY is $20, and Fallout New Vegas (same engine and mechanics as F3 is $10 without any DLC.

Continuing with the MMORPG discussion...

Any theme and any setting can work for mmorpgs. My first foray into mmorpgs was City of Heroes. I quickly learned all kinds of people did not want to rpg... most merely wanted to level. I either played with friends or soloed... while ignoring most everyone else. The MMORPG can be a blank page for players to write their own stories. And I had some good stories and great fun in CoH... Bratman (highly strung diminutive second cousin of Bruce Wayne) and RN (bubble brained platinum blonde healer) were my favorite heroes.... while Sour Grapes (insane clown) and Shameless O'Seamus (Irish gang leader) were my favorite villains.

World of Warcraft did not lend itself to really letting me tell my own stories, even though Fantasy is my favorite genre. But WoW really lent itself to casual guild fun. My big elven warrior, Sethralia... or Auntie
Seth to the guildies, sponsored challenges.... no one in my guild would be the first on the server to explore new areas or finish certain quests, but I would pay out prize money while my guildies would spend more money on armor repairs than I was offering to the winner.
 

Boaz

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Reading my previous posts... it seems like I don't like Fallout 4. Actually, I do. I've finished the game four times now.... the last as recently as a month ago.

In every play through, I've told myself, "This time I am going to side with the Brotherhood or the Railroad or even with the Institute. I need to explore other areas and aspects of the Commonwealth and people." It never works. Never. I always eradicate the Railroad and the Institute. I go to war with the BoS.

Here's the skinny...

Oh... uh... Spoiler Alert!

The Institute.
Stated Goal: Saving the world.
Actual Goal: Kidnapping, Murder, Terrorism, and Chaos.... the Ends Justify the Means.
Sean has been indoctrinated to such an extent that he believes that he is Father. He has no acknowledgement for his murdered parent nor respect for his surviving parent. He believes his own destiny as Father... But in Institute speak, Father means mass murderer, peace means terror, and a better future means suffering and death.

The Brotherhood of Steel.
Stated Goal: Saving humanity, rebuilding the world, and proper use of technology.
Actual Goal: Murder of all opposition, fascism, and technology to enslave humanity.
The establishment of order in a chaotic and violent world is a good thing. But they alone, and by 'they' they mean their Fuhrer. Blind obedience to a cult of personality is reckless at best. Oh, they're brave... no doubt. Oh, they're true believers... no doubt. But the price of their success is an invasion of the Commonwealth (this very name finds new meaning under their regime) and trust that they will build a better world through murder and slavery.

The Railroad.
Stated Goal: Liberty, Equality, and Fraternity.
Actual Goal: Institute infiltration point for espionage, sabotage, and terroism.
The Railroad takes it's name from the nineteenth century American activists for abolition... and once I found out what Fallout 4's Railroad is doing, my character must destroy them for their blasphemy. Des and Glory are 'escaped' synths. They never consider that they are programmed and planted by the Institute for it's own ends. In order for synths to escape the Institute, there must be a covert group within to assist them... and there is no evidence of such support. All the evidence shows that the Institute knows everything the Railroad does and plans. And let me mention that the Railroad insists that there is no difference between humans and synths. WTF?!?! The only difference between a synth and a nail is it's appearance and it's multiple uses. It's still a creation of human beings. It is not a human.

The Minutemen.
Stated Goal: Timely paramilitary support for individuals and families building communities in a peaceful Commonwealth.
Actual Goal: Timely paramilitary support for individuals and families building communities in a peaceful Commonwealth.
Despite the fact that Preston Garvey is unprepared for his role... uneducated in leadership (inspiration, vision, finances, organization, and social infrastructure) and overy opinionated, he has a pretty good moral compass. When you find Preston's band, he insists on Sanctuary Hills as their destination even though Red Rocket, Abernathy Farm, and maybe Starlight Drive-In are closer. The Minutmen, alone of the factions, are honest. Their leadership of Preston and Gunny Grandma is beyond pathetic, but their commitment to actually doing good for humanity is unquestioned.

Every time I've used a nuke on the Institute.... and I've never given the alert to evacuate. Preston hates this. I don't blame him, but given the parameters of the mission and the realities of the situation, I've chosen to not evacuate the Institute. How many children die in the explosion? I dunno.... they're conspicuously absent from view every time I've been there. But I am offended by Preston's labeling of the scientists, non-military personnel, and spouses as innocent. I believe they've woken up every day of their adult lives and decided to engage in active kidnapping, torture, and muder upon the people of the Commonwealth. It's in my character's power to either grant clemency (thereby disseminating the values of intellectual totalitarianism and Father Knows Best throughout the world) or to condemn (thereby eradicating the physical, societal, and intellectual (a huge loss!) presence of the Institute). They lived by the mantra Father Knows Best... well, my character is Father's Father or Mother.... and so I used their own policy against them. I judged it better to attempt to preserve humanity's humanity than to support the devaluation of human life.

Anyway, the story bogs down at points. And the desire to see it all (it's a big world) tends to lead to decisions that suspend belief.

Also, I've played the DLC since my first game.

Nuka World. If you've read how I've reacted to the Brotherhood, the Railroad, and the Institute, then you'll know how I've dealt with the Raiders of Nuka World. I found this completely devoid of any meaningful story.

Automatron. Nice little story. It's over too quickly. But it's just another way to add robots.... it does not add human npcs. Wasted opportunity.

Workshops. Build more stuff in your settlements. Really breaks the story if you do this before finding Shaun. It's nice if you want to keep playing a certain character beyond finding Shaun.

Far Harbor. By far, the best DLC. It introduces a missing persons case for Valentine Detective Agency. The story quickly escalates inside a mini-world. A new companion. Three new factions... Acadia (the Railroad for the completely delusional), Far Harbor (insular and unpleasant humans), and the Children of Atom (they make the Brotherhood seem rational). A competitor to Nuka Cola. And Nick's origins are revealed. The highpoint is in choosing which faction survives.

Vault Tec. An Overseer (over two hundred years old and half insane) is now recruiting for residents in order to prove her Mengele inspired social utopia. You can build your own vault. Great concept! Too bad the build points are so limited. I could not build half of what I wanted.
 

Paul J. Menzies

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@Boaz

I play a little different... first off Preston never gets to leave the museum till absolutely necessary--when he can go straight to the Fort. I've never met a more irritating game mechanic. He defeats the entire idea of sandbox singlehandedly if one follows the game plot.

I craft like mad and explore the bare minimum till I'm level 60 (what a grind) to max the numbers of top end power armor.

Then conduct all-out war on The Institute and The Brotherhood and eventually I will take down The Railroad but I have more sympathy for them.

You can fudge the build restrictions on your own vault, like any other settlement, but it really isn't worth it. Can't do it enough to fill all the space and it will screen lag you to death trying.

I did surround and cover the swimming pool at Greentop with a vault and glass ceilings which looked pretty cool. TTYTT that was the big thing for me in FO4 and what it brought that no other game did... the building aspect. Absolute best thing about it. The combat is too ridiculously easy with VATS, even on high levels, to find combat anything other than annoying. And power armor is really only necessary on "Survival" and even then not later when you're perked up. But building, in predefined spaces. That was fun.

First time on Far Harbor with all that fog had my heart going though... but you get used to it pretty fast.
 

Toby Frost

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I worked with the Railroad both of the times that I've played the main story to the end. I had to kill the Brotherhood by blowing up their airship (a good mission) but they started it, so fair enough, and I never liked them anyway. It also meant that I didn't have to kill the Minutemen and I could ignore Preston trying to give me more missions (hooray!).

Nuka World was simply a bloodbath once I'd recaptured the various areas. By the end it was like a Nick Cave ballad with bits of raider everywhere. It's one of the silliest bits of Fallout 4 and there isn't really a story, but it was fun to explore (and blow up).

Far Harbour is really impressive, and includes a lot of interesting stuff. The main story of it isn't bad, but the exploration element was excellent. I've never much bothered with the base-building element of Fallout 4 (or other games) as I make models and I think that covers that. I did build some suitably bizarre robots, though. Ada is now bright blue and very large.

For me, the main appeal of Fallout is exploring and finding new things. I think it does this really well, and it's an excellent game. Once I've to the end this time around, I'll probably just start again.
 

Davelectro

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I worked with the Railroad both of the times that I've played the main story to the end. I had to kill the Brotherhood by blowing up their airship (a good mission) but they started it, so fair enough, and I never liked them anyway. It also meant that I didn't have to kill the Minutemen and I could ignore Preston trying to give me more missions (hooray!).

Nuka World was simply a bloodbath once I'd recaptured the various areas. By the end it was like a Nick Cave ballad with bits of raider everywhere. It's one of the silliest bits of Fallout 4 and there isn't really a story, but it was fun to explore (and blow up).

Far Harbour is really impressive, and includes a lot of interesting stuff. The main story of it isn't bad, but the exploration element was excellent. I've never much bothered with the base-building element of Fallout 4 (or other games) as I make models and I think that covers that. I did build some suitably bizarre robots, though. Ada is now bright blue and very large.

For me, the main appeal of Fallout is exploring and finding new things. I think it does this really well, and it's an excellent game. Once I've to the end this time around, I'll probably just start again.
Love Fallout 3, my favorite. Then I like New Vegas and FO4 would be next. For atmosphere and truly epic moments, 3 is hard to beat, may be my favorite game ever.

You made some nice points there - Far Harbour is awesome. Nuka World is pretty extreme and provides a wild, violent, more fight-intensive experience as a counterbalance to Harbour's foggy murkiness (not that there's any lack of action in Harbor, that's for sure).

Now you're making me want to play 4 again! Only played it twice and the last time was a few years ago.
 

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