15,000 scientists can't be wrong

Cathbad , relatively few people look at the big picture. Live for today and let tomorrow take care of itself. Maybe that's a reason why we've found no other intelligent life out ther,e because maybe they took the same attitude that people in our world are taking now and died out as a result of short sighted thinking about the fate of their worlds. :unsure:

Like I said...

~shrug~
 
@BAYLOR and @Cathbad, I'm not sure that @Mike Donoghue was saying that the 15,000 scientists were wrong, just that they could be wrong. I don't believe that they are wrong about climate change and that it's man made, but there's no doubt that 15,000 scientists have been wrong before. Physics for example has undergone some significant revisions in my 67 years.
 
@BAYLOR and @Cathbad, I'm not sure that @Mike Donoghue was saying that the 15,000 scientists were wrong, just that they could be wrong. I don't believe that they are wrong about climate change and that it's man made, but there's no doubt that 15,000 scientists have been wrong before. Physics for example has undergone some significant revisions in my 67 years.

Phew! Glad someone explained it. Thanks, Parson.
 
That's apparently the idea. "Since they might be wrong, they're obviously wrong." I'm not even sure what kind of logical fallacy this is! :confused:

This is not what I said, so I'm going to explain this critical point before this runs out of control.

Most people in the world do not know what the SCIENTIFIC METHOD is and think that "scientists" are simply people who wear lab coats, play with chemicals, rocket ships, can explain complex stuff about the natural world, make crystals crawl up a glass, etc. In reality, a scientist is someone who practices the scientific method in a given field and continually checks and rechecks theirs and others works to come to their conclusions. In this case, it's climate science and reputable institutions known for following the scientific method are raising the alarm.

We need to be cautious, though, always cautious, because as Parson wrote, revolutions in understanding do occur and that is the only way we are sure of the facts. We need to trust the conclusions of a climate science institution not because we see it researches the climate, but because we know they are using the scientific method to come to those conclusions.

Trust in the scientific method first, then the scientists who we know are applying it. It has and does occur that politics, corporate, and, yes, personal greed taint scientific studies that go on to form the basis for public policies and culture attitudes. I am not saying this is the case for reputable climate change science institutions.
 
Trust in the scientific method first, then the scientists who we know are applying it. It has and does occur that politics, corporate, and, yes, personal greed taint scientific studies that go on to form the basis for public policies and culture attitudes. I am not saying this is the case for reputable climate change science institutions.

All great reasons to never trust scientists.

And I find that sad, actually. You do realize that to become accredited (degreed) scientists, they had that course in scientific method (which most people probably first learned about before high school)?
 
Actually, you know what?

I'd like someone to explain this to me: 15,00 scientists are saying we need to clean up our planet. Now... let's say their predictions of doom and gloom are completely wrong - every one of them.

What's the downside of doing what they suggest?

"Oh, my gods!! We cleaned up the air and water for absolutely no reason!!!"

:confused::confused::confused:
 
This is not what I said, so I'm going to explain this critical point before this runs out of control.

Most people in the world do not know what the SCIENTIFIC METHOD is and think that "scientists" are simply people who wear lab coats, play with chemicals, rocket ships, can explain complex stuff about the natural world, make crystals crawl up a glass, etc. In reality, a scientist is someone who practices the scientific method in a given field and continually checks and rechecks theirs and others works to come to their conclusions. In this case, it's climate science and reputable institutions known for following the scientific method are raising the alarm.

We need to be cautious, though, always cautious, because as Parson wrote, revolutions in understanding do occur and that is the only way we are sure of the facts. We need to trust the conclusions of a climate science institution not because we see it researches the climate, but because we know they are using the scientific method to come to those conclusions.

Trust in the scientific method first, then the scientists who we know are applying it. It has and does occur that politics, corporate, and, yes, personal greed taint scientific studies that go on to form the basis for public policies and culture attitudes. I am not saying this is the case for reputable climate change science institutions.

I think this is quite obvious, and for the clearly scientifically literate people here, a lot like saying "water is wet."
 
All great reasons to never trust scientists.

And I find that sad, actually. You do realize that to become accredited (degreed) scientists, they had that course in scientific method (which most people probably first learned about before high school)?

No, cathbad, I wouldn't say that's a good reason not to trust scientists. I would say that is a very good reason to trust scientists. The only time I don't tend to trust scientists is if there is heavy industry funding backing them or if the scientists work for an industry known to be controversial. Then I'm going to be a bit more skeptical about their work.

The thing is, a lot of people get these false equivalencies going. Scientists need to be doing this, doing that, blah blah blah, but oh look, there's this stupid ass right wing blogger over here, his opinion is perfectly valid!

This is a tactic used commonly by the tobacco industry, and was so obscene it's basically got the a name, so let's call it the Tobacco Fallacy. It's where your evidence is all right, and you build up this massive burden of proof requirement for the other side to have to prove, when you take the high ground because "oh, that's just how it is."
 

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