8.02: The Walking Dead - The Damned

REBerg

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I never thought that I would think this: too much action!
I realize that the alliance needed to hit all the Saviors strongholds simultaneously, but I had some trouble tracking who was doing what where. Could be just me. :)
Horrible moment when Rick discovered that he had just killed a man defending his infant daughter.
 

ctg

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"Whatever happens next, we've already won!" Rick said. In fact he shouted that to the people to make them inspired about the chance to strike back. It's just he didn't saw what was coming as all he wanted was a clear victory. Hence he also said, "Kill them all."

But there are no hard set futures, because not all people will follow such orders. Jesus turned out to be the last guy to commit all out slaughter even though his first rescuee were an agent provocateur. Maybe he has a heart of gold for making their job incredibly hard. Thing about the prisoners is that they need guards and facilities, which Ricknation has neither.

Back in the Prison, a mass incarceration could have been possibly, but when you take twenty plus men and woman as prisoners, you're committing large number of people to guard them and make sure they're well kept while they're prisoned. Then you've three choices: exile, death or freedom.

I don't think anyone other than Jesus has heart to kept them alive. Even Morgan after his miraculous survival was keen to put down Jared as soon as he saw him. In fact, he could have executed him from the distance and nobody could have been able to done nothing to stop him. Not even Jesus. This way maybe Morgan gets another chance to find his soul as he certainly lost it, when he got shot.

But that's the thing, if you're clearing a building, don't play by the book, because your enemy will do upmost to make your life miserable. Morgan's, Jesus and Sasha's group could had drilled holes in the walls, before they committed themselves to clearing the rooms. It would have been easier, but in the same time, same thing could have been done by the Saviours in the room.

The fight I wasn't so sure about was Aron's and Eric's as they wasted so much ammunition for very little effect. Why Saviours didn't flee at the moment they were fired upon is beyond my belief. Same thing applied to their seemingly impervious vehicles, which didn't see to take any hits. There were no bullet holes, no gasoline or oil leaks. No fires or sparks from shot electrics. The corrugated iron panels offered more protection than actual real life armour panels.

And they wasted thousands of rounds, without anyone carrying extra clips. So it is the details that failed in this fight rich episode. What I loved were the dead. People who died and came back in Aron's and Eric's battle. You wouldn't have thought that the casualties were going to get you, but when the world has turned upside and everyone carries the virus, death without a head injury will bring you back.

In the fight that has now been raging for two episodes there should be loads of casualties and people, who needs care for their wounds. In a normal day every wounded man takes two fighters out from the battle. Minimum. The gunshot wounds are worse to treat than nicks from blades, because the damage goes far deeper than what you can plaster with normal means. And thing is Ricknation has only one doctor, and he is in the Kingdom. So I would predict that not so many get to come back from this war. But without this war, things would be very bad in terms of survival. Without it Ricknation would have to pack their bags and leave the DC Washington area for good.

Horrible moment when Rick discovered that he had just killed a man defending his infant daughter.
Yeah. But afterwards, why didn't he pick up the baby or alerted Daryl that he'd made contact with the enemy? Why Daryl didn't come running as soon as he fired the gun?
 

nixie

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A lot of action in this episode, I had to rewind a couple of times.
Jesus wanting to take prisoners didn't surprise me, Tara wanting to kill them all did.
I'm worried about the infant, unless I missed something Rick left a dead body in the room next door without making sure it couldn't get back up.
 

Culhwch

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I realize that the alliance needed to hit all the Saviors strongholds simultaneously, but I had some trouble tracking who was doing what where. Could be just me. :)
I also had a little bit of that. I feel like there was a bit of inconsistency as well, that might have been some laziness on the part of the writers/director.

For instance, in the firefight that Aaron was directing, it seemed the tide turned when the fallen Saviours rose up and attacked the living Saviours, but then that wasn't referenced again and the Saviours seemed to quickly gain the upper hand following that. Rick and Darryl also had a couple of others with them, who were quickly forgotten. If that building was behind the courtyard that Aaron and company were attacking, why not sneak up and catch them in a crossfire?

Morgan's transformation from pacifist to angel of vengeance has felt a little too rushed, though it seems like they're suggesting he's having a bit of a mental break now, so that could tie in. I have to say I'm on Jesus's side in all that - Saviours or no, it's immoral to just execute surrendering enemy combatants. Imprisoning and potentially trying them adds a new wrinkle, of course, but it would distinguish them from the Saviours.

EDIT: And again with endless supply of bullets!
 
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Steve Harrison

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It felt like a killing time (and lots of other things) episode that didn't add much to anything. I picture the writers saying, "keep shooting until we think of something!"

Still, it was better than those regular old wandering-alone-in-the-woods-in-an-attempt-to-make-a-minor-character-interesting stories.
 

ctg

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And again with endless supply of bullets!
Most of them are in normal 7.62mm or 5.56mm, but there was odd number of guns that uses .308 or 9mm. My rough estimate is 1500 to 3000 rounds at Aron's battle. No grenades. No molotovs. No surprise strikes from the flank or rear as you said. And most of the fight was in the setting that was a trap for the lookout soldiers.

I also had a little bit of that. I feel like there was a bit of inconsistency as well, that might have been some laziness on the part of the writers/director.
I think there was much more material for this episode than what they used for this edit. Some of the might had ended on the floor to keep the 42 minute limit. This sequence might look different if it's watched back to back with first one and following episodes. But to be honest, it felt like a really long and difficult battle, just as it was depicted in the comics.

Still, it was better than those regular old wandering-alone-in-the-woods-in-an-attempt-to-make-a-minor-character-interesting stories.
True. Still how many can remember Moralez from first season?

I'm worried about the infant, unless I missed something Rick left a dead body in the room next door without making sure it couldn't get back up.
I wouldn't. Rick knows the value of babies. So he would have made sure that nothing would harm the young one.
 

svalbard

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I also had a little bit of that. I feel like there was a bit of inconsistency as well, that might have been some laziness on the part of the writers/director.

For instance, in the firefight that Aaron was directing, it seemed the tide turned when the fallen Saviours rose up and attacked the living Saviours, but then that wasn't referenced again and the Saviours seemed to quickly gain the upper hand following that. Rick and Darryl also had a couple of others with them, who were quickly forgotten. If that building was behind the courtyard that Aaron and company were attacking, why not sneak up and catch them in a crossfire?

Morgan's transformation from pacifist to angel of vengeance has felt a little too rushed, though it seems like they're suggesting he's having a bit of a mental break now, so that could tie in. I have to say I'm on Jesus's side in all that - Saviours or no, it's immoral to just execute surrendering enemy combatants. Imprisoning and potentially trying them adds a new wrinkle, of course, but it would distinguish them from the Saviours.

EDIT: And again with endless supply of bullets!
I think the showrunners have had Morgan building towards this moment all through the last season. He almost had a mental breakdown in The Kingdom. Maybe this is a continuation of that breakdown.

I have to say that I am with Tara on the prisoners. Unpalatable as it is they have to go. Rick's group do not have the numbers or facilities to hold POWs. In this type of conflict eliminate the fighters.
 
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ctg

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I think the showrunners have had Morgan building towards this moment all through the last season. He almost had a mental breakdown in The Kingdom. Maybe this is a continuation of that breakdown.
I didn't even remember his breakdown from last year, as for long time Morgan has been unstable. I saw that old crazy man in him, when he miraclously woke up and started slaughtering people. It was that same man Rick met when he searched weapons to fight the Governor. That man had lost his wife (unable to pull the trigger) and his son, and the PSTD had taken his mind.

Maybe Morgan build Alexandria's prison cell for himself as he knew he was going to Carol breakdown one day in the future. The Kingdom boy's death almost flipped him over, while seeing the man he tried to calm down twitching in his last moments made him to see red.

To be honest, I cannot see how they can keep Jared's kind of killers from total exile? In FTWD Madison sent Troy in the wilderness with one bullet, and he came back with a horde. I don't think Rick has choice but sentence some of the Saviors to gallows.
 
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