Does Trek canon still exist?

Scifi fan

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We have a new timeline, so any continuity errors can be explained away, and, in any case, errors in canon have been cropping up since Voyager and Enterprise anyway. In fact, as I understand it, since Enterprise went on the air, there have been regular continuity errors anyway.

Last, but certainly not least, Kahn and his cohorts were supposed to be the products of late 20th Century genetic engineering and were cast adrift after a great war. That hasn't happened.

So I don't think there's canon anymore.
 

Dave

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Last, but certainly not least, Kahn and his cohorts were supposed to be the products of late 20th Century genetic engineering and were cast adrift after a great war. That hasn't happened.
Didn't the Voyager crew change history when they went back in time and gave Starling a silicon chip. That started the seventies computer revolution. ;)

In the year 2347, the Daystrom Institute proved conclusively that the future is a quantum mechanic objective basic probability. All events past and future are equally real. The 'Many Worlds' theory predicts that every possible outcome to every event defines or exists in its own "history" or "world". Everything that could possibly have happened in the past, or in the future has occurred, or will yet occur, in the past or the future of some other Star Trek universe or universes. :)

(I made that up; I still have trouble not accepting non-linear time, and like Janeway, Temporal Mechanics gives me a headache!)

I expect you are correct though - there can be no Canon.

Anyone want a second hand copy of the Star Trek Chronology?
 
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TheEndIsNigh

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Dave:
Anyone want a second hand copy of the Star Trek Chronology?
LQ (more of a giggle really)

I've missed the commentary on the last ST film. (probably not looking had something to do with it)

What a load of nonsense.

If that wasn't a desperate attempt to reinvigorate all those old plots for the next twenty films then I'll eat my hat.

(well actually all my hats have already been consumed but you get the idea)
 

Scifi fan

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If that wasn't a desperate attempt to reinvigorate all those old plots for the next twenty films then I'll eat my hat.
Desperate is the word. The thing is, the franchise is dying, and, unless the fan projects can revive it, it will die.
 

Arwena

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It seems two new canons have been created, one from the movie, and the other from the novels with the Borg invasion. I'm reading Losing the Peace, it seems like the Star Trek world after the Botg invasion is a depressing place in more ways than one.
 

Scifi fan

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I don't think novels are canon, unless they're incorporated into the movies, which is unfortunate. That said, there may be no canon anymore, and the franchise may not be long for this universe anyway.
 

littlemissattitude

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I don't know.

I quite liked the most recent film, and thought they handled it is a logical manner.

On the other hand, I have a friend who insists on the canonical status of the original series and saw the most recent film only because everyone was giving him such a hard time about his adamant refusal to see it. And, because it wasn't "canon", he hated it.

I've never been a stickler for canon in anything, though (and I enjoyed a recent argument I read that insists that there is, and can be, no canon in Doctor Who), so I'm probably not the best person to be commenting on canon. And, I do like the idea, and have since I was very young and could first reason such things out, that everything that can happen, has happened, is happening right now, or will happen in the future in some timeline or another, in some universe or another.

Is it any wonder that time-travel stories are my favorite sub-genre of science fiction, even though they make my head hurt sometimes.
 

Omphalos

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Ive only seen the new film once, and that was my "does it suck or not?" go through. Ill get it for sure when it comes out on video, cause it sure didn't suck. But they have so many problems in the past that they really, really needed a good reason to reboot the whole thing. Im thinking that if they give up on the whole utopia thing, it might just be worth the time to watch future ST.
 

TheEndIsNigh

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The plot was rubbish and a travesty of all those hours spent watching the TV and the films. (which were never that good anyway)

It was another come out of the shower moment.

Next we'll find that JR is still alive on Romulus and Bobby is the next Captain of the Enterprise
 

Rodders

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I would imagine that there are a lot of ST fans who will ignore the new JJ Abrams addition in it's entirety.
 

Scifi fan

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TEIN and Rodders, you're both right. I liked the movie, because it was good fun for a couple of hours, but, in the end, no one can rejuvenate a tired franchise if the people are tired.

Only the fans can save it now.
 

Vladd67

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Having just watched it I think it is an interesting way to reboot the whole Star Trek idea, they have effectively found a way to wipe the slate clean and restart with what I personally think was the best era of Trek. Maybe because they are the characters I grew up with but they have always been my favorites. The writers of recent versions just seem to have got bogged down with a self righteous squeaky clean view of the future. Trek got tired and flabby this new version seems to be a valiant attempt to trim away the fat and present a new look to a new audience. This can now stand alone as a separate entity and can be enjoyed by people who don't have a fanatical knowledge of the previous Trek history. I know people who had no previous interest in Star Trek who gave this film a go and enjoyed it, these are the sort of people Trek needs to attract if it is to survive. No matter how long something has been around, without a fresh interest and continued profits new projects will not be made.
 

Urien

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Trek Canon?

I know Kirk once used a home made cannon to stop a super strong man in a plastic lizard suit.

Flipping aliens and their gladiatorial better than thou games. Typical. Reminds me of the Cotswolds.
 

chopper

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Trek Canon?

I know Kirk once used a home made cannon to stop a super strong man in a plastic lizard suit.

Flipping aliens and their gladiatorial better than thou games. Typical. Reminds me of the Cotswolds.
nurse! the stirrups!

*keels over*
 

Dave

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Hey! It was a relatively low budget weekly TV show made in the sixties. Don't knock the Gorn (super strong man in a plastic lizard suit) too much! What gets me about that episode is the polystyrene rocks that bounce off his back. That Gorn was so strong we never ever saw him again!
 

TheEndIsNigh

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Here today, gorn tomorrow :)



Oh come on, what are the chances that one would be missed?
 

Rodders

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Perhaps the two franchises can run side by side so that there is two "Canon"?

To be honest, it may have to be that the original cannon stops. With the exeption of the nevels, there doesn't appear to be much hope for the old style Trek anymore.
 

Dave

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Perhaps the two franchises can run side by side so that there is two "Canon"?

To be honest, it may have to be that the original cannon stops. With the exeption of the nevels, there doesn't appear to be much hope for the old style Trek anymore.
I've given plenty of ideas in this forum for how Trek could carry on. Just a few: 29th Century Timeship, a mini-series of standalone stories based on important future events which we never heard much about, a series set on a Klingon ship.

I'm not sure what you mean by old-style Trek, but I think there are several reasons why the franchise fell from grace:

1) There was too much Trek!!! When Enterprise was in it's first run, there were re-runs of the other series at the same time. At any one time, somewhere in the world, there is always Star Trek on TV. There is over 6000 hours of Trek made! They have done just about any story possible, so every new episode is always a little bit like another older one.

2) Paramount just didn't appreciate what they had. They killed the golden goose. There were too many Brannon Braga type stories that dealt with the mind, and not enough Ira Steven Behr type stories of political intrigue and alien societies. Making a prequel like Enterprise was a big mistake and fans said so. Then, just when it got better, they cancelled it. Every single other Trek series got worse in the third year and improved in the fourth (if there was a fourth) only to go on to hit the heights in the fifth, sixth or seventh series.

3) None of the later series captured that triangular relationship between Kirk, Spock and Bones that worked so well. It is that relationship that made the original series so good, and it is still lacking from the recent film, so I don't hold out a lot of hope there.

4) Technology just overtook Trek. Everyone has a communicator now, only it is called a mobile phone, it is smaller, and it works better. Computer memory is unbelievable cheap and computers are tiny and more powerful than would even be believed at the time of Voyager. Why does Janeway have a desktop computer the size of a 1950's TV set? Stories about nanobots and genetic research are just out of date. So how can you realistically extrapolate technology into a distant future from one that has already been overtaken by events?
 

Rodders

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Yes, i would definately agree that there was too much Trek at the time. I would even go as far as to say that they should have stopped for a while after DS9. IMO, there was no real reason for Voyager and Enterprise.

I am in the same boat as you Dave. I would have loved to have seen a series where the Federation was "Perceived" as the enemy. A series set among the Romulans.
 

warstarcerberus

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Hey! It was a relatively low budget weekly TV show made in the sixties. Don't knock the Gorn (super strong man in a plastic lizard suit) too much! What gets me about that episode is the polystyrene rocks that bounce off his back. That Gorn was so strong we never ever saw him again!
true but in enterprise :eek:they have a gorn i believe is the only other time they [he] are seen.:)
 

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