Christian Fiction

[RVM45]

.....Do any of y'all read Christian Fiction? The Genre has grown expotentially the last couple decades; and in my opinion, much of it is quite good. If you don't believe, you can, nonetheless, read it as pure Phantasy;SF; Romance; Action/Adventure; whatever; (It's an eclectic genre.)

.....Consider Jenkin and LeHaye's best-selling "Left Behind" series. Opinions may vary; but I'd say that even for someone who believes in a Pre-Tribulation; Pre-Millenial Rapture- as in fact, I do- would nonetheless, class the series as Phantasy. It has not happened YET; it involves forces and beings that aren't (Generally) visible today; and Jenkin and LeHaye almost certainly have not avoided some minor errors as to just exaclty how things will unfold. Biblical scholars argue vociferously about some of the minor details

.....Be all that as it may. I've never tried to write any Christian Fiction. I Certainly hope that my stories are Christian Friendly- but that isn't quite the same thing.

.....Be all that as it may. I have two Novels in progress; and I occasionally feel the urge to do a short story- plus I make multiple daily posts on about a dozen Forums. Yet, I'm starting to plot out a Christian Fiction story.

.....It will be unique so far as I know, because I want to do a first person narrative by a Vampire; and yet keep it Christian Fiction.

.....A few words of explaination: Fundamentalist Christianity would seem to rule out Vampirism(It certainly rules out ghosts. Dead souls go straight to heaven; or hell- period. However many demons try to impersonate the dead; and lead folks astrtay...)

.....Anyway, lets just stipulate that there are Vampires. Vampires were always portrayed as having a damned soul. Then "Buffy" came up with the idea that Vampires don't have souls.

.....Not all Fundamentalist believe "Once Saved: Always Safe"(Though they should). However, if one believed OS:AS; it would certainly seem to rule out a saved person becoming a Vampire. Once again, let's specify that it did not.

.....Even people who believe OS:AS tend to lose sight of it sometimes- and sometimes they fall into sin. A Christian who became a Vampire through no fault of his own; might come to the conclusion that he was damned- even though he'd still be under grace. Believing himself damned anyway, he might succumb to some of the bloddy urges of his Vampirism- yet even at his worst; he'd feel something restraining him from the worst depravities. He might be motivated to seek redemption at some point- that's a common Vampire story theme anymore. The epiphany would be when he realized that he didn't need redemption- that he'd never ceased being redeemed.

....Well I,m not sure the story is doable. Any comments?

.....RVM45

 

[Xwing Mom]

Hmmm...this one would be tricky to write. I think your last paragraph would work as the plot for the idea. But how would you work out the conflict between his guilt over his actions and his realization that his redemption is eternal?

On a shallow level, he would either have to cease being a vampire or renounce his faith.

I'm not sure how you'd work it out trying to maintain both. Wasn't there a sci fi program on tv that dealt with a similar issue....not necessarily a Christian vampire, but one that wanted to do what was right?

 

[Lith]

.....Anyway, lets just stipulate that there are Vampires. Vampires were always portrayed as having a damned soul. Then "Buffy" came up with the idea that Vampires don't have souls.

Well, Buffy didn't invent it. But a being without a soul is actually a mindless zombie, since your soul is most properly your sense of self, your consciousness. But within fiction it's pretty common to have it be something else, which is actually your heart or conscience. Follow?

I'm an Evangelical, but I think I lost official Fundamentalist status some time ago, if I ever fully had it at all. I personally don't believe in "once saved, always saved", or in predestination, and I quit believing in the Rapture around, oh, 1999, when I realized that what everyone was telling me were signs of The End Times weren't, and weren't even as bad as what people suffered in the last 50, 100, and 1,000 years. The end will come when the end will come, period. As such, I haven't read Left Behind, nor will I, but I don't want to get into any debate about it.

Christian fiction (as opposed to fiction written by Christians) tends to only appeal to Christians, as its message is usually so strong that it loses its appeal among the general public. Nothing wrong with a market existing specifically for Chrsitians though. I'm not too well read in the genre; I read one Christian romance novel, I think it was by Lori Wick (???), and it was about the most gooey, worst-written thing I've ever read, and I've been put off the genre for life. (Sorry!) I finished it only because a friend of mine asked me to read it.

The situation you're proposing with a vampire is doable, but you'd have to explain where he'd gotten the idea that he had lost his salvation, where vampires come from, how he or she gets their blood if they don't get it from other people, whether they need it at all. You'd also have to explain why the vampire thinks that because he's lost it's still okay to go on sinning- if he loves Jesus more than anything, wouldn't he still want to follow Jesus, and sit outside even a locked door, in desperate hope? He'd not only be guilty of carnal sin, but also despair and lack of faith which, in my opinion is the worse sin. It's a small little piece of an idea now; but it would take a lot more thought to make a good, meaningful story out of it.

There is a Christian Fiction thread in General Books. If you do a search, you will find it- the thread's busy gathering dust somewhere in the void.

And vampires looking for redemption is a pretty common theme- Can't think of any specific instances, but I know they're out there.

 

[RVM45]

.....Well, if that's all there was to it; it wouldn't be much of a story. I always watch things on TV; or read, and then I get to thinking.

.....I like Vampire stories. One thing that I particularly like, is figuring out the rules. Are these Vampires affected by garlic; crosses; holy water; silver; fire; sunlight? Can they fly? Use mind control? Eat? Get nourishment from human food? Have sex? Are they necessarily evil?

.....But why couldn't you have more than one variety of Vampire coexisting in the same world? There is more than one species of bear; great cats; even plagues- why not Vampires?

.....I envisioned "Greens" as a fairly powerful type of Vampire; that exist mainly by voluntary donors- while both donor and receptor share a sort of orgasmic experience; and the green's saliva has addictive elements. Greens as a general rule, try to avoid conflict. They're blood is green due to lots of bilrubin. This poisons their blood for other Vampires. It also means that unless one has gradually built up a tolerence over a long period of being a donor; the chances of sucessfully crossing over and becoming Green are only about one in three. Greens tend to act and talk like pimps; mooching money and a crash site from donors- and bragging to other Greens about the size of their stable of donors.

.....Reds are very similar to Greens powerwise; but they prefer to kill. They act like a bunch of Klingons- always feuding and snapping. They like to kill other Vampires and drink their blood- for more power. Can't drink Green's bloods; but like to kill Greens just on general principles.

.....Masters only exist during night hours. Sunlight doesn't bother them; but about a half hour after sunrise, they simply vanish; only to reappear about a half hour before sunset. The older and more powerful they become, the more daylight time they get before they vanish. A very old; very powerful master might exist for three hours after dawn; and three hours before sunset. A master has no daylight period of increased vulnerability. On the other hand, a Master bodyguard would be worthess during most of the day.

.....There are Oranges. They're little more than souped-up humans. They live as humans; and mostly subsist on human food. However, a meal of fresh human blood two or three times a year lets them live four or five human life times. They're only marginally stronger; and able to heal than a normal human.(Still. a six foot, 240 pound man who could outsprint an Olympic sprinter- though only by inches; outlift a world class Power Lifter of his weight class by a few pounds; and do every manuver a 90 pound Olympic Gymnast could- and heal a broken bone in four weeks; instead of six; would still be a dangerous opponent.

.....Then I ask myself, why do so many Vampires act as though they have diplomatic immunity? Well in my world, any Vampire-slain corpse that makes it to sunrise witout being discovered; automatically metamorphasizes to look like it died of natural causes. Also, at all times there is a strong force that makes it very difficult(though not impossible) to take the idea of Vampires seriously- even when that's where all the evidence leads.

.....I planned on my character being A Green; with nothing but contempt for the ordinary Green SOP. He lives mostly by poaching wild game- deer; Rabbit; Squirrel; birds; Catfish; etc. He drains the blood; then sells the meat; fur; animal by-products to poor folks who appriciate discount meat.

.....Occasionally when the bloodlust gets too bad, he goes to a big city to kill a child molester; pimp; ATF agent; or some other type of low-life scum.

.....He doesn't think much about his condition; outside of beaucoup black brooding; until he gets drafted into doing a long-term good deed for some orphans.

.....He became a Vampire when he unknowingly dissed a Green; who knocked him out; and gave him a big I.V. shot of Green blood(not the standard way to cross someone over) just to see what would happen. He often wonders if his incomplete compulsion to be evil, is a result of his unconventional conversion.(He also promptly found and killed the Green, once he realized what had happened to him.)

.....Well anyway, that was a good warm-up. Going to start working on Chapter Ninteen of "Darkness" in a few moments.

.....RVM45

 

[Xwing Mom]

I read one Christian romance novel, I think it was by Lori Wick (???), and it was about the most gooey, worst-written thing I've ever read, and I've been put off the genre for life. (Sorry!) I finished it only because a friend of mine asked me to read it.

You one upped me...I never got beyond the first couple of pages of one of her novels... But before you give up completely on that particular genre, try one of Dee Henderson's. The romance part is secondary to the main action.

 

[Pyan]

And for another interesting take on the subject, try;

Job:_A_Comedy_of_Justice by R.A. Heinlein.

 

[Peter Graham]

The story is eminently do-able, as it appears that you will be writing what essentially amounts to a parable or allegory about the nature of divine grace and redemption.

Your real problem, I suspect, is that it will not find a wide audience. Those of us who do not believe in any form of divinity will probably not be interested. Personally, I would always assume (perhaps wrongly, but there you go) that any book tagged as Christian fiction will, at some point, start moralising and preaching. People who do believe in a divinity but not a Christian divinity are also unlikley to be particularly interested, as obviously to them your world view would be wrong and/or heretical and/or misguided or whatever. You might even have issues with the various branches of the Christian communion - the fundamentalist, evangelists and moderates all have very different views of doctrine and teaching.

None of this matters if you are writing for your own pleasure or for a defined group of potential readers, but if you are writing this book with a view to commercial publication, I think you might have some problems.

Best of luck with it!

Regards,

Peter

 

[Winter Lord]

Two reasons that crosses work against vampires, Faith, and that the cross is a sun symbol. Of course, vampires didn't go poof in the sun until F.W Murneau maybe his rip-off of Dracula.

 

[RVM45]

.....Gosh, I must say, I think some of you got the idea that I intended to write a much more preachy, moralistic story than I intended. I meant for it to be fun.

.....VP(View Point Character) is a Vampire. It's kinda fun to have super human strength; and not age. He can't work; because of the sunlight thing- who wants to work anyway? He hunts and fishes year round. With his senses, strength; resistance to injury; he can stalk a deer at night, and cut its throat with a knife. He can also walk rings around any game wardens with night-vision equiptment. What outdoorsman wouldn't like to be able to do that?

.....He's heard that having become a vampire means he's damned. He broods about it a bit; but basically puts it out of mind. He finds that while he has no compulsdion to be pathalogically cruel; or ostentatiously evil; that sometimes he enjoys hunting down and killing rotten people; who by most reckonnings "deserve" it.

.....He basically declines to help anyone, as a general rule, because he thinks being helpful is not consistant with what he is- yet occasionally, he gets imposed upon.

.....During one major imposition- probably his biggest effort to help anyone since crossing over; he comes to the conclusion that there is no good reason to assume that a vampire is anymore damned than anyone else.

.....The down-side; and for him it IS a big downside- is that if he's still saved; he can't continue to kill even Pimps; child molesters; and ATF agents for fun anymore-at least not in good concious- and there's some obligation to evangelise his fellow vampires- remember, he doesn't even like to be around other vampires.

.....This happens late in the story.

.....I should think large parts would still be good escapist fiction...

.....But maybe I'm wrong...

.....RVM45

 

[Winter Lord]

Are your vampires the type that just drink blood, or can they eat regular food too?

With the sunlight thing, is it poof into flame, or just a nasty reaction to UV or Infrared?

One thing that I would like to see with vampires is the reason that they don't like mirrors is because mirrors show them from what they really are.

 

[Paradox 99]

This is an interesting thread to me, mainly because

a) I used to be a fundamentalist Christian who believed in "once saved always saved", but am now an atheist.

b) Vampire stories, though often cliched, can be interesting.

As has been already said, your market for this novel would be extremely small because most born again Christians probably wouldn't feel comfortable reading a novel about vampires. If you're writing it just for the fun of it, great. Just don't expect to ever sell it!

As far as the whole vampire/Charistian concept goes - I don't think a novel like this would be a problem to write. If vampires were a reality, I could certainly count as an X-Christian in the category you're talking about, and I could easily be involved in the vampire culture without being concerned about salvation (until later in your story of course).

What's fascinating to me is that the vampire myth probably evolved from the Christian myth anyway:
Gaining eternal life through eating the flesh and drinking the blood of the Son of God? Sounds like the seeds of a vampire myth doesn't it? All you need to do is build on that, and there are plenty of other parralels too.

Good luck with it.

 

[Meadowhawk]

As has been already said, your market for this novel would be extremely small because most born again Christians probably wouldn't feel comfortable reading a novel about vampires. If you're writing it just for the fun of it, great. Just don't expect to ever sell it!

I don't want to argue, only disagree

Christian Speculative Fiction is on a huge upswing (in the U.S.) after decades of being ignored. I got to spend some time talking with a writer of Christian YA Fantasy. And while he does get his share of "Blasphemer" hate email, he has almost a million books in print--in Trade Paperback, not Mass Paperback, by the way! He is the headliner for a new imprint for Zondervan's (one of the biggest, if not THE biggest Christian Press); he just finished writing the second in said urban fantasy series that is a little edgy. And he just penned a deal with a publisher for a 2 book deal for an adult urban fantasy duology.

So... what people think they know about Christian publishing is being spun on it's ear--make it edgy, avoid cliches, and write what your heart tells you to. That, and you're a writer. Go a little more sparingly with the ellipsis... ellipsises... ellipsii... what's the plural of that word?

 

[Lith]

There is a distinct subsegment of the Christian population that this sort of thing would appeal to, but I would agree that it probably wouldn't appeal to the majority of Christians (at least in the US). There's too much of an anti-magic, anti-Potter, anti-fantasy, anti-occult, anti-GOTH attitude. However (and this is a big however), there's still a place for this sort of thing, if it's done right. RVM, it sounds as though you have a pretty good idea of where you're taking this- the only thing to do is to go there, however badly you may do it at first.

X-wing mom- I'll keep that in mind. I don't do romance anymore anyway, but if I run into one of her novels, I'll take a look at it.

Rather off-topic, but I bought a CD a few years ago that was for a Christian goth-rock group called the Deadlines. Unusual to say the least; they had a sort of undead thing going on, with fake blood and stuff, and had been kicked out of several church venues for their act, even when they backed it all up with Scripture. Unfortunately, I left the CD with a friend and never got to listen to it...


...I love elipses...just thought I'd say that...and no... I don't know what the plural would be...

 

[RVM45]

I use the five dots to preserve my indents. On a couple of forums, it got to be such an issue that I gave up the practice on each of those forums. It frosts me, when I indent at the beginning of my paragraphs; and the computer justifies it to the left.

.....Don't use the dots in my writing.(Three dots is an elipses- do my five dot spacers also qualify as elipses?)


.....RVM45

 

[fire_elf20]

elipses are 3 dots only 3 not five