How much magic is acceptable? It feels like cheating!!

[Laerten]

How much magic is it generally acceptable for a character to use to get themselves out of situations? Too much and it just feels like cheating!

For example:

I am stuck at a point in my book where a young couple are giving over care of their twin babies to a 'sorceress' for protection (they are being hunted by the baddies as they are going to fulfil a prophecy). I cannot seem to convey enough emotion for this scene and I was going to have the sorceress use magic so the parents 'forget' their distress but after I wrote it the scene just seemed flat for such an emotional moment. I deleted the magic!

Any help? I can't move on until I have sorted this out as I feel the amount of magic used (or not) in this scene will affect the rhythm for the rest of the book.

 

[The Curious Orange]

If it were me writing, I would use no magic whatsoever. I agree with your assessment of your magic use as a cheat. If it's an emotional, heartbreaking scene, then don't be afraid to break your reader's hearts.

And yes, I agree that it's difficult to convey this level of emotion when you write. It's something most new writers agonise about.

Here's what I do - less is more. I find, in my own writing, that if I have this sort of scene I tell it sparsely, with no emotional baggage or purple prose. Simple sentences, few if no adjectives or adverbs. Make it cold and neutral. If you have created strong characters that the reader cares about, then the reader will bring their own emotions to the scene. Don't make the mistake of telling the reader how to feel. Let them decide.

It takes a lot of confidence in your writing ability to make this leap of faith, trust me, but its worth it.

 

[Ursa major]

Or you could intensify the poignancy of the scene, perhaps by getting the sorceress to protect herself and the babies by making the parents forget what has happened, but leave them with the (now unexplainable) sense of loss and grief.

 

[Laerten]

If the scene happens quite early on in the book, how would I go about letting the reader know the reason for this separation without too much dialogue or explanation? Would it create more suspense and keep the reader hooked if the prophecy is referred to without actually explaining the details?

 

[Peter Graham]

Hi Laerten,

I think this is something of a moveable feast. In response to your original query, I'd say that the use of magic has gone beyond the acceptable if any of the following situations apply:-

1. If it is being used to paper over cracks or inconsistencies in the plot.

2. If it is being used as a convenient or easy way of opting out of dealing with a particular situation which you can't otherwise see how to resolve (the "big black dog came and ate them all up" scenario).

3. If it is being used as a plot device akin to the use of coincidence.

4. If it is being used as a way of denying your characters the chance to succeed or fail by their own actions and choices.

Good luck! And to touch on Shamguy's concerns in the neighbouring thread, I'd worry less about defining rules for magic (magic is, after all, just a product of imagination, so how are rules really going to help?), and concentrate instead on just writing a rattling good yarn.

Regards

Peter

 

[Daniel Hetberg]

If it's not possible to do this early in the book, maybe doing it as a flashback would work, after the prophecy has been explained elsewhere?

 

[Lith]

My brother says that magic in a story is like wine; a little is a blessing, but a lot is a curse. (Or however he said it...)

Magic is basically an exception to natural laws. If magic has definite, consistent rules, then it becomes (within the context of the story) just another set of natural laws. If it is truly super-natural, then it can easily become a crutch or a deus ex machina, which drains the story of importance. Why is that? I think it's because we use stories in part to teach us things, and if the resolution comes from without, then we haven't learned. Furthermore a story sets up a certain conflict, and in order for the solution of the conflict to be satisfying, the resolution has to come from within the parameters set at the outstart.

This is why magic almost always comes with a price. Otherwise, it's like playing Calvinball: you make it all up, whenever you want it, and there's no way to determine if you've won or lost, because there's no constant, and no conflict.

So the sorceress removes the distress- what's the price the couple pays? Is there some later moment at which that lack of emotional struggle becomes a problem for them? If they haven't learned to deal with unhappiness, then does it form a pattern of begging magic users to help them forget their troubles? And after a lot of that, over perhaps years, what are the consequences? Is there a bodily effect, do they die quicker? Is there a psychological effect- they don't mature, or become addicted to "emotional painkillers", or become unable to form new memories, or become all screwed up emotionally because things are out of balance, and the natural process of grieving is distrupted, which could give them anything from neuroses to obsessions to mood swings, psychotic states... you get my drift. There are thousands of ways this could come back to bite them, and some of them are not immediately dramatic, but could build into a slow, powerful pathos by the end of the story.

And perhaps there is tension and drama in the scene, but you haven't learned how to write it yet. That takes study and practice, as well as coming back to the manuscript after a break (presumably after you finish the entire first draft), and then you can look at it with fresh eyes.

 

[Urien]

How much magic is acceptable? Depends how hungry you are.


*SHAZAM!*

Can you see me now?

 

[Laerten]

The couple aren't really going to suffer for much longer in the story as they die a couple of hours later in a fire. The baddies are responsible for setting their house on fire and they don't know whether the babies were killed - this leads onto a 'classic' scenario of a normal upbringing/discovery of being the subject of prophecy/hunted by the baddies etc. etc.

I have the whole outline for the novel and am slowly 'filling in the pieces' but I have now found that I am stuck with this topic - how much magic to use - that I never gave any thought to (I do have rules governing magic such as side effects, types of magic etc.).

 

[The Curious Orange]

What are you witing? A system of magic, with a story attatched to it, or a story, with some magic in it?

Try looking at your magic system the other way round. Instead of asking yourself how magic works, and then bending your story around those rules, try doing it the way I do. Outline the story, decide on all the things that the plot demands that magic can and can't do, and then look as those requirements and devise a system of magic rules that is in line with them.

One of the best "quick fixes" for this I can think of is Robert Jordan's Aes Sedai. Although all of the magic-users are part of the same order, with the same over-arching set of rules, this order is divided into sub-orders, or Ajahs. Sisters of each Ajah have vastly differing abilities. The Yellow Ajah are healers, for example. Sisters of other Ajahs may, or may not, have healing abilities. This is used to explain how one Aes Sedai has no healing abilities, while another has extensive powers. Red Ajah keep no warders, while Greens keep several. Browns are academic, while others can be ignorant. Any narrative problem can be easily solved by having the relevant Aes Sedai be of the wrong Ajah to do that particular spell.

It's a great system of near infinite flexibility - magic can do whatever it needs to, or be incapable of doing what is asked of it, purely by ensuring that a sister of the correct Ajah is present, or absent.

 

[Ghost of Harrenhal]

I really can't stand magic after branching off into more historical novels and more believable fantasy like A Song of Ice and Fire. I stay well away from it in my own writing simply because I imagine it is hard to come up with a (plausible) yet original system for its use.

 

[Lord_Rahl]

I really can't stand magic after branching off into more historical novels and more believable fantasy like A Song of Ice and Fire. I stay well away from it in my own writing simply because I imagine it is hard to come up with a (plausible) yet original system for its use.

I hate to say it to you, but if it doesn't have magic and/or made up races and creatures etc, then it's not really fantasy IMO.

 

[Winter Lord]

How "cheap" is your magic? Does the working of spells, cantrips, and incantations exhaust a wondworker?

 

[Laerten]

The magic uses up a persons strength, the stronger a magic user the less they feel the effects. Some of the strongest are able to 'gather' energy as they need to use it from other magic users (evil ones take it by force).

 

[Meadowhawk]

I'm stretching here, as I have not read any of the mss, but I find myself wondering if I, as a reader, need to have the scene at all. If the characters are about to die and do not contribute to the plot, is this perhaps more of the backstory that you, as the writer, need--not me, as a reader? Are you just trying to show how bad the baddies are? Mayhap the drama and emotion of the slaughter of the parents would better be revealed closer to one of the battles between good and evil?

Now, if you find the scene pivotal to your conflict and story--I would say, yes, some show of compassion from your good mage, perhaps simply putting them to sleep while she leaves with the kiddles, would be a contrast to the violence of their pending slaughter.

 

[lathark]

I don't normally reply to these but...

Bring on the turmoil. Stop protecting them with magic, put their babies in danger too, and have the sorceress break a leg, ...and the arm, so she can carry only one. Then have one them develop a terminal disease, so it really messes with their focus.

 

[Mazrak]

For example:

I am stuck at a point in my book where a young couple are giving over care of their twin babies to a 'sorceress' for protection (they are being hunted by the baddies as they are going to fulfil a prophecy). I cannot seem to convey enough emotion for this scene and I was going to have the sorceress use magic so the parents 'forget' their distress but after I wrote it the scene just seemed flat for such an emotional moment. I deleted the magic!

Any help? I can't move on until I have sorted this out as I feel the amount of magic used (or not) in this scene will affect the rhythm for the rest of the book.

In this example I would not use the magic. Simply for the chance of survivall of the parents. They should know what they have sacrificed and why so that they keep on running/hiding/fighting against the baddies.

The amount of magic that is acceptable I think would be up to a point that it would still be believable for the reader and fits in your world. The reader shouldn't get something like: Why don't they just use magic here like they did before and their problems are solved. That can be difficult to do and therefore planning can also be an immportant part of writing.
What I did in one of the worlds I created with the magic was making it addictive and so dangerous for the user. It can be used safely but the stronger the spell used the stronger the addiction. To much of these spells and the sorceror would end up like a junk.

 

[Shingetsu]

Magic is troublesome, it needs a very beliveable system of what can and can't be done and limits with side affects.

Aes Sedai with their different abilities and power; the Blood with their different jewel ranks for power(Anne Bishop); the Skill and destroying the users body by using it too much(Robin Hobb), all have interesting systems for magic with consequences.

In The Syphony of Ages by Elizabeth Haydon there was no "magic" exactly, but swords with elemental properties and different races with "abilities." One of those abilities is being a Namer, where Rhapsody would sing to get certain vibrational responses to happen.

I agree though, it does feel like "cheating" in a way. I suppose it's working on the system so it doesn't feel that way. Which is why I will be requiring allot of thought about my own...

 

[Laerten]

Thanks for all the suggestions. I am in the middle of a re-write of the problematic scene and have come up with the following solution:

My 'sorceress' has no direct contact with the parents (she sends another to get the babies) as she is hiding nearby and 'reflecting' on the events which have lead up to this situation arising. This also solves the problem of introducing the reader to the central prophecy theme without having to have a prologue.

When the babies are brought to her there is a mention of the parents anguish/distress without having to go into greater detail or show the use of magic.