Question re Secret Keepers...

[HoopyFrood]

BTW - I love your username Hoopy! Just kind of rolls off the tongue...

Thanks...I like it too

And yes, I am a "really amazingly together" girl

 

[Majimaune]

So everyone, then!

Yeah except the Order Of The Phoenix.

 

[Crazihors]

Hagrid said in PS that the Potters had already gone into hiding, and maybe that was before Harry was born, so the spell wouldn't have included him. could it be like making the house unplottable, like Hogwarts? Hermy says in one of the books that if a muggle went to hogwarts they would just see it as a pile of ruins - which is what Godric's hollow was described as in PS. prehaps their bodies were seen because the spell no longer protected them, being dead.
Which has just madew me think of something else - hogwarts could be under the fidelius charm as well (up til HBP) - the letters inviting new students to the school were written by Dumbles (i'm assuming), which would mean that nobody who had been invited would be able to come - of course, that isn't much of a defence seeing as most of the death eaters went to hogwarts anyway...

has anyone thought of the implications for harry trying top find Godric's Hollow? he was only 1 at the time, so he can't remember it...

 

[Majimaune]

Godric's Hollow I am presuming is a small village or something like that so he would be able to find it on a map.

 

[xander838]

i thought that the 'Fidelius Charm' that was used to hide Lily and James was used to hide the location they were staying at so the charm would have been on the house not the Potters themselves the same way it was used on Grimauld Place to hide the HQ of the Order

 

[Erin99]

Yes, and that was my point: If the house was under Fidelius, who could actually *find* the Potters on the night of their death? The house, even if the people are dead, should still be under the charm. And presuming Wormtail didn't divulge the house's location to anyone other than Voldemort and the Death Eaters, the Potters' bodies should have remained hidden to Hagrid, Sirius, and anyone else who came to find them...


Then again, the house did get destroyed, so perhaps that broke the charm. The only trouble with that is [see post number 16].



You know, I find it easier not to think on it too much.

 

[mirinda]

Actually I think certain people were told by wormtail where they were. Other people could know they just couldn't tell anyone else, only wormtail could tell. So they could see the Potters as long as wormtail told them.

 

[xander838]

Okay, I've read it. Thanks!

But I've realised it's a paradox. From reading the excerpt I posted in my first post, it sounds as if it was the house under the charm, not the Potters themselves. If this is the case, however, then the bit in the book that HoopyFood pointed out, about Voldemort pressing his nose against the glass, couldn't work; the house would be invisible, just like Grimauld Place was to Harry at first. So Voldemort wouldn't be able to press his nose up against the glass -- he wouldn't be able to see a house there! Or so I'm assuming...

i see what you mean about this, if it was the same as Grimauld Place then Voldemort pressing his nose up against the glass would not work, but i would have thought that, that quote was just metaphorically speeaking that he could be right outside and not see them.

Your point about the house being destroyed, i agree i would think that it would break the charm when the object(in this case the house) was destroyed

 

[Majimaune]

Yes I think that the destroying of the house would brake the charm. Also isn't there something in the sixth one where Dumbledore dies and that body-bind one that he puts on Harry lifts.

 

[xander838]

yeah, your right the spell that Dumbledore cast on Harry was broke when Dumbledore died

 

[Erin99]

Yes I think that the destroying of the house would brake the charm. Also isn't there something in the sixth one where Dumbledore dies and that body-bind one that he puts on Harry lifts.

However, if I can just direct you back to JK's original quote, which I pasted on page one of this thread:

When a Secret-Keeper dies, their secret dies with them, or, to put it another way, the status of their secret will remain as it was at the moment of their death. Everybody in whom they confided will continue to know the hidden information, but nobody else.​

 

[Majimaune]

Ahh yes so that could be an unknown amount of people. Only Wormtail would be able to tell anyone though.

 

[xander838]

yeah, any number of people could know the location but one the secret keeper can tell anyone

 

[Erin99]

Well, as far as I know (and this is just speculation), Wormtail will have informed Voldemort and NOT the Death Eaters (so he can gain Voldemort's favour), and then Voldemort went to the Potters' house to "do the job" himself.


So, perhaps Wormtail didn't reveal the location to anyone save Voldemort. He couldn't have told Sirius and Remus; we know this because those two suspected each other of being the spy in the Order. Therefore, I don't think anyone else, besides Voldemort and Wormtail, knew the Potters' location. Unless anyone else can think of someone Wormtail might have told...

 

[Majimaune]

I think all the Potters closest friends would have known where they were just only Wormtail would be able to tell anyone. Lupin thought it was Black who was Secret Keeper and therefore be thought Black betrayed the Potters but it was really Wormtail who was Secret Keeper and only Black knew that other then the Potters themselves.

 

[Erin99]

But if Wormtail told Lupin, Lupin would know that it was Wormtail who betrayed the Potters on the night of their deaths (because there's no other secret-keeper). And the same for Sirius too.

 

[Majimaune]

Ahh yes but no one told anyone. The only reason Sirius knew was because be asked for Wormtail to be made secret keeper instead of him. He didn't tell Lupin it wasn't him because of the suspicion thing between them all, not knowing who it was.

 

[Erin99]

Ah, yes, now I see where you're going with this. Forgive me, yesterday I was feeling extremely tired, so I hadn't followed your meaning. I bow down to you, Maji.

 

[xander838]

i agree with most of the but surely Dumbledore had to know where they were or he wouldn't have know where to send Hagrid to get Harry

 

[Majimaune]

No Hagrid would have had to know because Dumbledore couldn't tell anyone either. I think all of the Order would have known but only Wormtail been able to tell.