Saurons depiction in the film

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#21
In the LOTR, Sauron was never really a big, burning ball of fire, he had a body.
Gollum proved that by saying that he saw Sauron's hand, and it had four fingers. The eye thing was sybolic, not literal, so technically Jackson's portraiyel was totally wrong. As for what I thought about it though, it seemed pretty cool.
 

paranoid marvin

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#22
Tolkein's potrayl of Sauron is unusual , in that we have the person ssumed to be the ultimate bad guy- yet he never speaks . It is almost as if he is cast in the role of a spirit , wo is incapable of performing any physical actions

Any evil deeds are attributed to the 'will of Sauron' , with Tolkein describing
him as merely the driving force behind all things evil in Middle Earth , and the fact that we are informed that Sauron can no longer be physicaly defeated
helps to confirm his status as an evil spirit than a corporeal monster

TBH I think the real bad guy , and the ultimate threat , in the books is Saruman - a good man turned to evil , and Sauron's natural successor.In time the frmer disgraced member of the White council would have been a far more powerful and deadly foe than Sauron himsel , not least because he has a physical presence
This is proven with the devastation of the Shire - an act of malice carried out with no reason than spite , and also with no need for any powerful magical items.Even Sauron was committing evil for a reason , for domination of Middle Earth - and don't forget , whereas evil creatures FEARED Sauron , they were actually quite friendly with Saruman , which I find more terrifying
 

hej

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#23
The ring being cut from his hand and instantly nullifying Sauron seemed a good idea to me. It creates force. We have just seen this demonic, unstoppable figure marching through legions of warriors who we just saw kicking orc-buttock, and then with the loss of that one little ring this nigh-god goes out like a candle. David and Goliath imagery inherent, also.
I see the scene that way, too. A sword cutting through armor I find problematic, but I accept as poetic license.

I did not see the David and Goliath imagery. Thank you for pointing it out.

Incidentally, Elhanan is the real conqueror of Goliath. Like many heros, David receives credit for the accomplishments of others -- who are unknowns.
 

vonHelldorf

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#24
Interesting topic!

Could the eye represent evil—how it's forever there, watching us, waiting for us to act in ways that pleases it?

You've got me thinking now. I'm going to have to go and watch the film. Damn ...
 

hej

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#25
Tolkien is very vague about Sauron. He purposely leaves him incorporeal, with no real idea of him at all. This works well in a book, but not in a film. They needed something to fixate on and allow the viewers to connect and fear. The Eye must have seemed the logical choice. It works well, and it's creepy, too.
I read the books a long time ago, and I did get a hazy picture of Sauron.

I thought Jackson's rendition of him was good. The film needed a corporal version to captivate the audience.

The Eye was great - a daunting image for the milquetoast hero!
 

farntfar

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#26
I haven’t got the films on DVD so I can’t check but I thought the depiction of Isildur cutting the ring finger from Sauron’s hand was actually quite well done, although I seem to remember the rest of the battle being less so.
As for Sauron’s appearance, he had, until the fall of Numenor, been able to appear wise and beautiful, although I think he lost this ability in the flood, as it were. But he certainly retained a physical body, until he lost the ring.

The relevant passage would be from the council of Elrond, when Elrond himself describes what he saw.

I beheld the last combat on the slopes of Orodruin, where Gil-galad died, and Elendil fell, and Narsil broke beneath him; but Sauron himself was overthrown, and Isildur cut the Ring from his hand with the hilt-shard of his father's sword, and took it for his own.

As for the eye, I always considered it to be a physical eye, since I first read the book at the age of 11 or so. I agree with many of you that the concept became more and more difficult to accept as I got older, and I found the Jackson depiction of it as a type of electric field or plasma to be very pleasing.

Again a relevant passage, from The Mirror of Galadriel:
But suddenly the Mirror went altogether dark, as dark as if a hole had opened in the world of sight, and Frodo looked into emptiness. In the black abyss there appeared a single Eye that slowly grew. until it filled nearly all the Mirror. So terrible was it that Frodo stood rooted, unable to cry out or to withdraw his gaze. The Eye was rimmed with fire, but was itself glazed, yellow as a cat's, watchful and intent, and the black slit of its pupil opened on a pit, a window into nothing.

And for the beam of light thing, you have to remember this was a film and all descriptions must be turned into pictures.
From the Breaking of the Fellowship:

And suddenly he felt the Eye. There was an eye in the Dark Tower that did not sleep. He knew that it had become aware of his gaze. A fierce eager will was there. It leaped towards him; almost like a finger he felt it, searching for him. Very soon it would nail him down, know just exactly where he was. Amon Lhaw it touched. It glanced upon Tol Brandir he threw himself from the seat, crouching, covering his head with his grey hood.

Some have said that Saraman was the real enemy, which I’m not really prepared to accept. He was AN enemy certainly, but was at least partly under the thrall of Sauron, via the Palantir, but I don’t think he could be considered the major threat.
Some have suggested that Saraman represents modernization and the loss of tradition, as shown by all the underground industry at Orthanc and by Sandyman’s Mill which was presumably just a watermill until Sharkey "improved" it.

Tolkien was certainly one who was upset by the erosion of traditional country life.
 

Mirannan

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#27
I see the scene that way, too. A sword cutting through armor I find problematic, but I accept as poetic license.

I did not see the David and Goliath imagery. Thank you for pointing it out.

Incidentally, Elhanan is the real conqueror of Goliath. Like many heros, David receives credit for the accomplishments of others -- who are unknowns.
It was a supernaturally sharp sword, wielded by someone with much more than normal human strength. Comparing that to comics, something like Wolverine's claws perhaps.

Even after 3000 years of neglect, the broken shards of Narsil were still capable of cutting flesh at a touch.
 

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