550 Words - Death & Torture - What is Acceptable?

[The Bloated One]

Hi Everyone,

I am writing a hard hitting Vampyre novel and need to understand what level of violence and death is acceptable. In the context of the plot, this gentleman has to die, and the manner of his death is an indication of his killers beliefs and motivation.

Any thoughts on grammar and tone are also most welcome.

The Death of Lord Ralston

He awoke to the sound of his bare feet, blooded and bruised, being dragged through freezing water along a gravel floor. He was moving quickly down a passage toward a light, his tortured body held firm by two men. A steady stream of blood flowed from his nose, filled his mouth and made him wretch. Reaching the light, he was thrown to the floor. Squinting, he looked up at the silhouette of a third man coming toward him, blocking the light and taking the hurt from his eyes. Lord Ralston raised himself up on his elbows.

"Why do you hate us?” He shouted, expelling a mouthful of blood.

"Hate you Lord Ralston? We do not hate. Hate is an emotion for animals, animals like you. You are an abomination to be hunted down and killed. We are justly ridding this world of your kind. It is not hate. It is love, our love of mankind."

"You are being used,” wheezed Lord Ralston, “the Ancient doesn’t want to share with you, or the rest of your people.” He coughed up more blood before continuing, “You will never see his promises!"

Grabbing Ralston’s head, the man yanked it backward and brought him to his feet.
"So, you think the Ancient is using us do you!” A ripple of laughter went around the room. "You are one of many we have killed. My Father, his Father and his Father before him dedicated themselves to lancing the vampyre puss that is you—you are a plague on this earth. It is our destiny. No one controls us!” Murmurs of approval went around the room.

Lord Ralston’s hands were untied and secured in manacles hanging from the cell ceiling. What remained of his strength gave out and he hung limply. The third man stood back and smiled.

"Before we send you on your way,” he said, flicking dust from the shoulder of his Saville Row suit. “I will need something from you. Where is the book and map," he asked quietly. Lord Ralston didn’t speak.

"You can do your race one last favour and save countless lives. Where is the book and the map!” Lord Ralston hung in silence, bowed but not beaten.
"Again, where is the book, where is the map. We know you have them."
Lord Ralston looked up, and defiantly spat blood at him. Calmly, the third man took out a monogrammed silk handkerchief and dabbed his suit. Shaking his head, he snapped his fingers and a wooden pole crashed into Lord Ralston’s bloated face, knocking him sideways. His mouth fell open, his jaw smashed. A ball gag was rammed into his broken jaw.

"Take his teeth."

The pain of flesh, teeth and gums riping and tearing, sent Lord Ralston into shock. Two six inch, curved ivory teeth covered in blood and gore were soon presented to the third man.

"You are nothing without these," said the third man, throwing them on the floor.
A colleague handed him an ancient samurai sword, just as two metal bolts thudded into Lord Ralston’s chest, piercing his heart. Bewildered Lord Ralston looked up as the blade swept down and decapitated him. The third man cleared his throat, and with a practiced hand ran the bloodied blade through his handkerchief and passed it back to his colleague.

“Anyone for tea?”

 

[tinkerdan]

Interesting piece.

I had a little trouble with this bit of dialogue.

"You are one of many we have killed. My Father, his Father and his Father before him dedicated themselves to lancing the vampyre puss that is you—you are a plague on this earth. It is our destiny.

I realize it is dialogue and that gives us a bit of latitude with grammar
Still you could leave the emdash and drop the you are to make the rest just a plague on this earth. You could even put a colon where the emdash is.

You are one of many we have killed. My Father, his Father and his Father before him dedicated themselves to lancing the vampyre puss that is you—a plague on this earth.

However if you leave it as You are a plague on this earth, it might be best just to make that a separate sentence.
"You are one of many we have killed. My Father, his Father and his Father before him dedicated themselves to lancing the vampyre puss that is you. You are a plague on this earth. It is our destiny.

 

[alexvss]

As this is an excerpt from a novel, I wouldn't be able to advice you for sure about the limits of violence. If it were a short-story, I'd say from experience that your chances of selling the piece may drop to zero. But the thing is, you have to find the right market (in your case, right agent and right publisher). There's public for everything.

However, I think that this piece is not violent (maybe my standards for violence are too high, so take my opinion with a grain of salt). You chose to write much more telling than showing, and that removes imagery from the scene.

Also, this reads like a screenplay. The description of the scenario is on the top of the page, with the dialogue on the rest.

Another thing I'd talk about are the deus ex machinas, mainly the ancient samurai word, but, as this is a novel, you may have explained that somewhere else.

 

[The Bloated One]

Alexvss,

Many thanks for taking the time to read and comment.

You're not the first person to see my style of writing as a screenplay! Funnily enough, I am working on one for my 2016 published book.

As for violence, I am only using it when necessary, so what you say is helpful. If it ever gets to the desk of a publisher I could always tone it down.

Swords - I looked into the sword that Vlad Tepes used, and it is likely to have been an Ottoman kilij. So, vampyres killed by the devils own sword? I like it, thanks for mentioning the sword!

TBO

 

[The Bloated One]

Tinkerdan,

Thanks, all good advice and I think for clarity, splitting it onto another sentence as you suggest is best.

TBO

 

[Wayne Mack]

I felt more confusion than violence. The confusion, I believe, prevented me from making any sort of emotional connection to Lord Ralston. I was unable to get a picture of where the scene was taking place. At first it seemed to be some sort of sewer, then a long passageway, then it was a cell. The feeling of violence is largely driven by anticipation, so I suggest taking more time to set up the scene, describe the cell, lay out the reason for the violence -- is it to extract information about the book and map or simply to brutally kill Lord Ralston? Two more minor points to consider: I found it confusing to keep referring to the main actor as the third man when the two henchmen are all but invisible in the scene, and six inch long teeth would extend well below Lord Ralston's jaw line.

 

[The Bloated One]

Wayne Mack,

All good points. I'll add some descriptive prose about the setting, and an explanation concerning the map and book. Also, something I should have done, is have Ralston's vampyre teeth 'grow' just before his death.

I'll post a revised piece shortly.

Thanks.

TBO

 

[The Bloated One]

Revised text.

The Death of Lord Ralston

He awoke to the sound of his bare feet, blooded and bruised, being dragged through knee high freezing water along a torch lit tunnel. He was moving quickly toward a light, his tortured body held firm by two men. A steady stream of blood flowed from his nose, filled his mouth and he wretched. Reaching the light, he was thrown to the floor of a cell, hewn out of solid rock beneath the castle. Squinting, he looked up at the silhouette of a man walking toward him, blocking the light and taking the hurt from his eyes. Lord Ralston raised himself up on his elbows and recognized Flint.

"Why do you hate us?” Shouted Lord Ralston, expelling a mouthful of blood.

"Hate you? We do not hate. Hate is an emotion for animals, blood sucking animals like you. Your kind are an abomination to be hunted down and killed. We are justly ridding this world of you. It is not hate. It is love, our love of mankind."

"You are being used, Flint,” wheezed Lord Ralston, “the Ancient doesn’t want to share with you, or the rest of your people.” He coughed up more blood before continuing, “You will never see his promises!"

Grabbing Ralston’s head, Flint yanked it backward and brought him to his feet.

"So, you think the Ancient is using us do you!” A ripple of laughter went around the room. "You are just one of many we have killed. My Father, his Father and his Father before him dedicated themselves to lancing the vampyre puss that is you. You are a plague on this earth. It is our destiny. No one controls us!” Murmurs of approval went around the room.

Lord Ralston’s hands were untied and secured in manacles hanging from the cell ceiling. What remained of his strength gave out and he hung limply. Flint stood back and smiled. It was rare indeed to trap a 500 year old vampyre.

"Before we send you on your way,” he said, flicking dust from the shoulder of his Saville Row suit. “I will need something from you. Where is the book and map," he asked quietly. Lord Ralston didn’t speak.

“We both know the map indicates the final resting place of Tepes and his followers, and the book the names of the original vampyre Ancients. You can do your race one last favour and save countless lives. Give me the book and map!” Lord Ralston hung in silence, bowed but not beaten.

"Again, where is the book, where is the map. We know you have them."

Lord Ralston looked up, and defiantly spat blood at him. Flint calmly took out a monogrammed silk handkerchief and dabbed his suit. Shaking his head, he snapped his fingers and a wooden pole crashed into Lord Ralston’s bloated face, knocking him sideways. His mouth fell open, his jaw smashed. A ball gag was rammed into his broken jaw.

“Inject him, I want his teeth.”

A man stepped forward and forcefully stuck a needle into Lord Ralston’s arm. Within seconds, his vampyre eye teeth descended.

"Take them,” commanded Flint.

The pain of flesh, teeth and gums ripping and tearing, sent Lord Ralston into shock. Two six inch, curved ivory teeth covered in blood and gore were soon presented to Flint.

"You are nothing without these," said Flint, putting them in his pocket.

Another colleague handed him an ancient Ottoman kilij sword, just as two metal bolts thudded into Lord Ralston’s chest, piercing his heart. Bewildered Lord Ralston looked up as the blade swept down and decapitated him. Flint cleared his throat, and with a practiced hand ran the bloodied blade through his handkerchief and passed it back to his colleague.

“Anyone for tea?”


TBO

 

[Danny McG]

One of my pet hates here, the difference between wretched and retched.
Also puss and pus

 

[The Bloated One]

Absolutely, well spotted - It should be retched, i.e.. vomited.

TBO

 

[TheEndIsNigh]

Violence: seemed a bit tame to me. Even Red Riding Hood goes further.

Six inch teeth raised a few eybrows - Well they would wouldn't they.

I am/did get confused about whether he's dead or not.

Hope I helped

Tein

 

[paranoid marvin]

A couple of things I would suggest. It might be better to describe the tunnel as dimly lit, so that he can discern a brighter light ahead (also I think it would be torchlit rather than torch lit?)

Hate is an emotion for animals, blood sucking animals like you.

I would suggest replacing the 'blood sucking animals' with 'creatures'?


Grabbing Ralston’s head, Flint yanked it backward and brought him to his feet.

Perhaps better to say 'hair' rather than head (assuming he has hair!)?


“You will never see his promises!"

This feels as if it could be better worded. " He is playing you for fools" or "his promises are empty" perhaps?


My Father, his Father and his Father before him dedicated themselves to lancing the vampyre puss that is you.

Should it not be father rather than Father? And 'dedicated their lives to lancing vampyre puss like you" sounds better to me.

 

[barrett1987]

The Death of Lord Ralston

He awoke to the sound of his bare feet, blooded and bruised, being dragged through freezing water along a gravel floor. He was moving quickly down a passage toward a light, his tortured body held firm by two men. A steady stream of blood flowed from his nose, filled his mouth and made him wretch. Reaching the light, he was thrown to the floor. Squinting, he looked up at the silhouette of a third man coming toward him, blocking the light and taking the hurt from his eyes. (Light, light, light - came across a little repetative and stood out when reading through.) Lord Ralston raised himself up on his elbows. (Is the original HE in this lord ralston? I wasn't 100%.) Lots of good sense images in terms of blood, wretch, bruises and freezing water. I'd mention smell might be worth placing in there instead of one of the ones where you are repeating a little? also, do he awake to the sound of his bare feet or the pain of his bare feet being dragged? I'd wake to the pain not the sound in this situation.

A few of the lines read a bit clunky to me. E.G Squinting, he looked up at the silhouette of a third man coming toward him, blocking the light and taking the hurt from his eyes. <-- it felt a bit removed from the experience. Squinting and looked are the same. He squinted up at....

"Why do you hate us?” He shouted, expelling a mouthful of blood. Think its lower case h for He shouted?

"Hate youCOMMA? Lord Ralston? We do not hate. Hate is an emotion for animals, animals like you.(remove this as its made clear in the next bit.) You are an abomination to be hunted down and killed. We are justly ridding this world of your kind. It is not hate. It is love, our love of mankind." I think a lot of this could be condensed. This is dialogue. He's talking about. Could this not be said in 1 good line rather than 3?

"You are being used,” wheezed Lord Ralston, “the Ancient doesn’t want to share with you, or the rest of your people.” He coughed up more blood before continuing, “You will never see his promises!"

Grabbing Ralston’s head, the man yanked it backward and brought him to his feet.
"So, you think the Ancient is using us do you!” A ripple of laughter went around the room. "You are one of many we have killed. My Father, his Father and his Father before him dedicated themselves to lancing the vampyre puss that is you—you are a plague on this earth. It is our destiny. No one controls us!” Murmurs of approval went around the room.

Lord Ralston’s hands were untied and secured in manacles hanging from the cell ceiling. What remained of his strength gave out and he hung limply.(limply..can you write this stronger? rather than say limply can you instead show limply..where are his feet here...maybe showing the reader the positioning of him and his feet would show it was limply and pull back to opening lines about his feet?) The third man stood back and smiled.

"Before we send you on your way,” he said, flicking dust from the shoulder of his Saville Row suit. (This savile row refernce is out of place so far unless its about showing the reader that we are in the 'real' world. In which case its fine or will be fine as the writing continues) “I will need something from you. Where is the book and map," he asked quietly.(Quietly is weak writing. I'd argue you don't need speech tags on this bit of dialogue and that the speech will be heard in the reader's mind as a whisper or intense bit of speaking IF the writing is strong enough.) Lord Ralston didn’t speak. (Remove - have another way of showing he didn't reply. Maybe show the talkers frustration, maybe the prisoner turning away. Anything that isn't saying ''he didn't speak' )

"You can do your race one last favour and save countless lives. Where is the book and the map!” Lord Ralston hung in silence, bowed but not beaten.
"Again, where is the book, where is the map. We know you have them." (I'd remove one of these. its repeating for little effect. Just get to the prisoner being active and spitting)
Lord Ralston looked up, and defiantly spat blood at him. Calmly,(remove!!) the third man took out a monogrammed silk handkerchief and dabbed his suit. Shaking his head, he snapped his fingers and a wooden pole crashed into Lord Ralston’s bloated face, knocking him sideways. His mouth fell open, his jaw smashed. A ball gag was rammed into his broken jaw.

"Take his teeth."

The pain of flesh, teeth and gums riping and tearing, sent Lord Ralston into shock.(the perspective got a bit distant here... might want to consider writing what going into shock is) Two six inch, curved ivory teeth covered in blood and gore were soon presented to the third man.

"You are nothing without these," said the third man, throwing them on the floor.
A colleague handed him an ancient samurai sword, just as two metal bolts thudded into Lord Ralston’s chest, piercing his heart. Bewildered (telling!) Lord Ralston looked up as the blade swept down and decapitated him. The third man cleared his throat, and with a practiced hand ran the bloodied blade through his handkerchief and passed it back to his colleague.

“Anyone for tea?”


================

Hey,

I only gave it a quick read. Take my opinion as just that, an opinion. I think i struggled a little on the pov this is being told from.
I also think it would benefit from cutting back the dialogue a lot. It could just be a style clash but the dialogue read stilted to me. Maybe consider saying what you are saying but with less words.

Hope any of the above helped.

 

[Aquilonian]

I think barrett1987 just said a lot of what I was about to say. For a vivid description of physical suffering you want kinaesthetic language not visual or auditory. He's been badly beaten at the very least, I'd have thought his eyes would be swelled shut, so not much to see except vague light and shade. Also smell and taste re his mouth being full of blood. The POV seemed to jump back and forth between 1st person and 3rd person.
Hanging limply by the wrists in metal manacles would be extremely painful not just on the skin of the wrists but also on the shoulder joints.
I wasn't convinced by Third Man wearing a posh suit to a very bloody torture/execution session.
If Third Man wants this map and book so badly, surely he'd be a bit more persistent in his questioning? Also where the Third Man refers to "saving countless lives" this seemed incongruous- if the Third Man thinks Lord Ralston is a monster why would he suppose Lord R would care about saving human lives?
"Sent Lord R into shock" is from an omniscient 3rd person POV who is familiar with medical terminology and uses it naturally. Third Man might realistically comment "he's in shock" but Lord R wouldn't be thinking "I'm in shock", rather he would be feeling the physical symptoms of shock (sudden loss of blood pressure and volition, falling/tingling sensation in solar plexus, sense of impending death, paralysis of thought process, etc).

 

[DrStrangelove]

The violence itself, as some have already pointed out, is not that striking. A wholeheartedly agree with what Aquilonian mentioned - a bigger emphasis on kinaesthetic language would greatly improve the overall scene. If these are the characters last moments and and he does not possess god-like willpower, I would emphasise the internal horror of the situation, make it a raw exerience, a flurry of pain and emotions.

Take the initial passage:

"He awoke to the sound of his bare feet, blooded and bruised, being dragged through freezing water along a gravel floor."

It is detached, descriptive in an emotionless way. Instead of sound the emphasis could be put dircetly on what the character feels - in such a situation I, for one, would probably first think about the pain, imagine bits of gravel stuck in my wounded soils and either moan or clench my teeth, trying to focus despite everything. You actually did it later in:

"The pain of flesh, teeth and gums riping and tearing, sent Lord Ralston into shock.",

albeit the phrase "riping and tearing" immediately brought to mind DOOM 4 OST. I believe one of the two would be enough.

 

[Bowler1]

For me, if you're going to do violence then it has to be violent. Fighting, unless it's torture which you have here, can't last long as it's physically demanding so when it happens don't hold back, make the point and get back to the storyline Steven King style. Torture can be drawn out, but if it is, be careful not to let dialogue dampen the mood and affect. Violence has to be shocking, and too much taking will kill that mood, which for me happened here.

So for me, you're an innocent lamb to the slaughter, and I do like my lamb cutlets cooked rare with blood that adds to the taste.

Go dark, go deep, let go and see where that takes you. If the storyline needs blood, then let it flow.

 

[Cosmic Geoff]

You ask what level of death & torture is acceptable. This piece is not excessively violent, so you are okay on that score.

To my eye there are various other things wrong with the text, e.g. a tendency to narrate rather than allowing us to feel Ralston's pain, an over- use of intial -ing words, use of the passive when you could use an active verb, and a rather token attempt to extract information.
In the last paragraphs, two metal bolts rather unacountably hit Ralston in the chest. Why do this if they are going to behead him?
The last lines make me belatedly think about the point of view. Obviously not Ralston's, since he is dead. So an omniscient POV? A close 3rd person POV would give more scope for showing Ralston's feelings, which are somewhat lacking here.

 

[RJM Corbet]

the last paragraphs, two metal bolts rather unacountably hit Ralston in the chest. Why do this if they are going to behead him?

To kill a vampire it's necessary to pierce his heart, actually a wooden stake is the traditional method. Decapitation alone wouldn't work?

I found myself reading from the first word.

Perhaps "Anyone for tea" seemed a bit out of place.

"Take it away, I need a drink" or something like that may fit better?

Great, confident writing, imo