Writing combat - the fantasy version of sci-fi technobabble

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So I was in a discussion with some others about writing and what makes a poor/good book and I got thinking on the subject of confusion of the reader with regard to detailed technical language. It made me think about a lot of combat scenes involving sword play and other hand to hand combat which often crops up in fantasy and how its very easy for the author to lose the reader.

Hand to hand combat has a whole range of styles and manoeuvres unto itself which each have a specific meaning and pose or flow of motions. Pirouettes, lunges, various types of deflection and stances etc... As a writer one can do extensive research and even go to re-enactment groups and play out these different sword manoeuvres before committing to paper complex and highly thrilling battles.

But are they thrilling to read? Well that depends on the reader, but I would argue that as time has gone on they are increasingly getting a little less exciting to read. More modern authors are using more advanced language to describe their battles and that is a good thing; it reflects a more detailed approach and really lets the author make effective use of limited words to describe a battle in a way that can be used to visually re-create it in the reader's minds eye.

However its like technobabble. Without the readers understanding of the subject much of the terminology becomes unintelligible. They get lost. That leaves them the option to either go find a book/google to work out what is happening or try to plod on and at least work out who won and lost the fight. Much in the same way that many don't have physics degrees enough to understand a lot of technobabble in a sci-fi novel; but will rely on the outcome and character reactions to it to tell them what is going on.

However there are other tools one can use too which are often forgotten. One is to be more descriptive early on; to use the technical terms, but to also mix them with more extensive description. To outline the steps and process going on so that you are in effect "teaching" the reader. Extensive use of heavier descriptive elements early on means that later they can be dropped as you don't have to tell; the reader now knows and they've not had to leave your book to find out. One or two tells and they've got it - or at least they also know another page in your book to come back to should they get lost in the future.

Now many reading that last bit will think "ahh neat so I'll do a "guiding teacher" approach to the early part of the novel to teach the protagonist what they mean too. However that is not what I'm saying nor suggesting. Indeed such methods must be very carefully used otherwise you run the risk that your "wise old man" going to appear too much the information source and less and less a character. Indeed for things like this you don't even need a guide to explain; you just need the variation in how you describe. Early battles might be simpler, shorter affairs; letting you devote more description to the terms, whilst latter battles might involve many complex moves and terms - easily done now because the reader is armed with the understanding - your fights just got more epic.




Now this doesn't just apply to fights; there are many many subjects that can be touched upon in a novel like this which can seem to the writer as easy to understand terms; but which can throw a reader. Indeed I feel that sci-fi deals with this better as often it is higher level science and as such most consider their readership needs the help. In fantasy so much is "old" science and "old methods" or technology so we less feel the need to explain it. It's "been done" and its "not new" but we fail to forget as a genre that just because its from our past doesn't mean we all know it. Indeed one can argue that any knowledge that is not current and modern is highly likely to require more detail.



So there are some of my thoughts and feelings and suggestions; what do you feel about this subject in general (remembering that the last point is expanding it out beyond just sword fights).



ps - I am amused that my spell checker software highlights technobabble as incorrect and thinks it should be technophobia.
 
As humans, I think fights are interesting to us because of the emotion behind them rather than the facts or technical details. We get an emotional response, not a mental one. It's dependent on the chaos and speed and violence etc. If an author therefore is at pains to explain this, I'd expect it to be counterproductive - instead of getting to the action, it's being slowed down with description and details.

Possibly one of the reasons this is hard for new or inexperienced writers to get the hang of is because TV and films have saturated the way we see genre subjects and they try to recreate the feeling favourite sections in movies gave them, forgetting it was the emotional response of the spectacle, not the spectacle itself.

I firmly believe it's important to let the readers create their own image of your world. We're not Court stenographers, but more, I think, a stimulus for the reader's own imagination, and as such, we shouldn't get obsessed with trying to show them how cool it all looks in our mind, but trust them to create what is cool for them in theirs.

pH
 
I am reminded of The Wheel of Time, where Robert Jordan gave unique names to all the maneuvers during sword fights. He never really explained how that maneuver actually works, but by reading the name it became an interesting puzzle deciphering the movements based on the name alone. Although, the names were usually obvious enough to understand at face value.

But that aside...

I don't think going the way of technobabble is the correct path to take with battle scenes.

It's a balancing act between getting the right amount of technical description to accurately describe what is happening, and involving enough fast pace writing and excitement/emotion that makes a battle scene interesting. If all you're doing is listing off technical words to explain what is happening then of course it is going to be boring, but lighten up on the technical writing and include some character depth of emotion and thoughts instead and you get something much more thrilling. It's not describing the actions that make it interesting, it's living the emotion of the scene alongside the character that enthralls people.

Also, some stuff just doesn't need to be described but rather implied in a way that the character would think it. If they are a technically minded person, they would use more technical words in their narrative, sure, but an average person wouldn't use so much technobabble as to confuse the reader. If you're forcing them to use that language then it's really just another form of distant PoV.

The same goes for everything in narrative, the actions and descriptions of events are second fiddle to the character's experience of said event.
 
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I think it's definitely possible to bog down any sort of combat with technical description! Fight scenes exist to provide fast-moving tension and excitement, if you slow it down with technical terms it no longer serves that purpose. Unless you're writing a martial arts manual, no one is going to care about the difference between a krumphau and a zornhau strike. It's much more important for the reader to be able to follow the action. When a fight scene relies upon a specific martial arts technique, the author can either choose to describe the combat technique, or only to describe the effects of that technique.

If a story is heavily focused on fighting, it never hurts to have the major characters show off their Awesome Special Attack early on. This is an incredibly common trope in Kung Fu Movies and Manga/Anime. ("Energy swirled around his head as Goku screamed KAME... HAME... HA!!!!!") It works because it forms an image in the viewer (or reader's) mind, so the next time someone yells "Kamehameha!!" you know they are about to nuke someone.

On the other hand, if you simply show off how powerful a fighting technique is, without explaining how it works, you can keep it mysterious. ("The master's hands barely seemed to move, but Tamir's sword clattered noisily to the ground.") Now the reader can spend several pages wondering whether the master was just really fast, or whether she used some magical or psionic technique... as the author you don't have to reveal it at all if you don't want to.
 
I read the Eisenhorn books and this was certainly a casualty of this. The Gunfights and unarmed combat were ok, but at the point where he invents a swordfighting style with its own unique jargon made it hard to follow, and annoying since the author clearly had no idea what this jargon was supposed to mean either. In my time training in Ninjutsu, I've done my share of trying to work out written movements and turning them into katas or techniques, and there is no written notation detailed enough.

For fantasy, I would say not to use language more complex than block, strike, parry, throw, fire, shoot, aim etc and make the scene interesting using the pacing, events rather than talking about a character using a tsuki with his tachi from seigan to his opponents kimon. Alternatively, I could just say he stabbed him in the chest with a sword, and everyone knows what's happening.
 
But are they thrilling to read? Well that depends on the reader, but I would argue that as time has gone on they are increasingly getting a little less exciting to read.

I'd say, detailed battle descriptions are just plain boring. I usually simply skip them and continue reading the following text - or simply stop reading at all.

One of the most serious errors a fiction writer can do is competing with Hollywood. No text description can compete with a short video clip however detailed and elaborated the text could be. Humans receive 80% of information through vision, which is a complicated mental and physiological process by itself. If fact, human brain is a specialized video processor, and all other sensory channels are secondary and optional. Reading text is equal to listening, and this channel simply has no proper bandwidth to receive the information with the same speed as vision. So a writer would require tons of time and efforts to describe a scene the reader could easily see in a second.

15 years ago, when I wrote my first fantasy-like novels, I visited an aikido school for half an year to learn how to properly describe hand-to-hand combat. In the end, I discovered that detailed descriptions of even a simple fight require so many words that it can easily lull the reader to sleep. Since then I insert only very short descriptions of single important movements and use general terms for describing the rest of combat.

Much in the same way that many don't have physics degrees enough to understand a lot of technobabble in a sci-fi novel; but will rely on the outcome and character reactions to it to tell them what is going on.

This analogy is not fully correct. Anyone studies physics in school, but very few people ever study hand-to-hand combat and sword-fighting techniques. So proper understanding of real-word special terms related to martial arts and fencing is usually impossible for most readers while many non-trivial physical terms and laws are commonly known.
 
That's a cool analogy. It's true, most detailed combat descriptions are quite annoying. However, for some people (including those that write them) detailed combat seems to be very fun. There are entire youtube channels with hundreds of thousands of followers of people who just talk about medieval weapons and their usage. So there's something to everyone - books with detailed combats for those guys, books without them for us, the commoners. :p
 
Wanderlog true its not a perfect analogy, however I would argue that the basics of movement that form part of a combat scene would be akin to the basics of physics most of us learn in school. Regardless its still the same that advanced use of technical language can end up losing the reader.

Even something as simple as a "parry" is quite an alien word to many who are not used to close combat arms discussion; whilst in truth a thrust and a lunge are slightly different things. In addition even those in the know will get annoyed because such terms will vary in how they visually appear and are used depending on the nature of the weapons used. To my mind this gives the author reason and motivation to be more descriptive in early battles at a basic level. The example Piousflea gives of the "super power" being shown early on is a good one; an early demonstration that later means only the technical word is needed.

Certainly there is balance in this and some novels will appeal to different people; there will always be those that focus more heavily on certain kinds of descriptive elements and might end up blocking out a segment of the readership. I think that by integrating basic and advanced technical terms it is certainly possible to at least maintain a larger proportion of readers
 
I think reader appeal is the big thing. In Abendau, for those who like military sci fi, they found the action pieces too short. For those who are more into charscter intervention over action, they worked well. For every reader who skips actions scenes - guilty face - there will be another who eats them up. The key, often, is the writing and I find strict point of view usuage is a key issue in keeping fight scenes tight and working.
 
I read a fight scene a while ago in which the POV character was in one-on-one combat, and being a master swordsman, his actions were precisely described: choosing a particular guard, none of which I knew, or predicting his opponent's actions from his stance, etc. But such detail worked really well, because it got me into his head and allowed me to picture (roughly) what he was doing, how he changed his position, etc. Also, crucially, it wasn't too long. But the same approach would have probably been a failure in a melee; I would have felt overwhelmed and started skimming, and the impression of chaos and excitement would likely be lost. So, it depends.
 
I read a fight scene a while ago in which the POV character was in one-on-one combat, and being a master swordsman, his actions were precisely described: choosing a particular guard, none of which I knew, or predicting his opponent's actions from his stance, etc. But such detail worked really well, because it got me into his head and allowed me to picture (roughly) what he was doing, how he changed his position, etc. Also, crucially, it wasn't too long. But the same approach would have probably been a failure in a melee; I would have felt overwhelmed and started skimming, and the impression of chaos and excitement would likely be lost. So, it depends.

I should have beem clearer - not neccessarily single point of view but the appropriate number of povs strictly applied to and easy to follow. Ergo no headhopping...
 
Well, I suspect it depends on the style of the story. The combat in a very “light” epic fantasy would probably be described in a very different way to that in a Bourne novel. I’ve read fantasy novels where things like this creep in: “Wild with battle-rage, he stormed forward with the Sword of Justice in his fists. Its shining arc swept death down upon the nargs”. Poor nargs. While this example is rubbish, I could imagine this style working in the right place. It helps to know how this story’s fighting works: are we going for elegance in the descriptions, or full-on neck breaking? Whatever it is, it’s probably best done quickly in simple language. “Special moves” or particularly cunning ploys could get a bit more description, to show how skilled/crafty the hero is.

I agree that PiousFlea’s example is a good one. I think it helps to show early on, probably outside an actual fight, that the character is skilled (or not) and then, once the mayhem starts, we can assume that it’s being done in a skilled way. If the story says “He cupped his hand as if to hold water, so he could strike with the edge”, we know that this person at least has some idea of what he’s doing. Of course, somebody out there will fly into an internet rage that you’re technically wrong, but that’s to be expected (what did these people do before they had the internet to be stroppy about?).

Incidentally, I have a specific question. How would people describe the bent-legged, one-foot-forward stance of fencers and martial artists? A “fighting crouch”, perhaps?
 
But such detail worked really well, because it got me into his head and allowed me to picture (roughly) what he was doing, how he changed his position, etc.

That comment reminds me of the recent film adaptation of The Equalizer, with Denzel. Before he cleaned house he visualised, very precisely, how we was going to approach the fight, what he was going to do, and then he carried out - all very quickly (16 seconds or something) - so that was a good way of getting inside the character's head from a movie point of view. It'd work well in a book too, if done well.

Sometimes you don't even need to portray battles at all. The heavyweights Tolkien and GRRM seem to avoid portraying huge set pieces, either telling in retrospect through a certain characters' eyes or recollections, or showing us the consequences of them. The only fight scenes of note are small (Oberyn vs Ser Gregor, Brienne at the inn, the Hound at the inn etc etc).

On the flip slide of the coin, Bernard Cornwell was extremely good at painting large, sweeping battles. But for me, he always kept the pace up. If you're going to do a battle scene, I think I'd go with either the character's emotional reaction to what's happening, or an omniscient view (perhaps the "General on the Hill" view) to show how the battle at large is unfolding.
 
Regarding fantasy battles, another interesting possibility is detailed description of magical duels. This does require, IMHO, a background magical system - which doesn't have to be explicitly described in the text in any detail - to supply the concepts and technical jargon. Some of this also applies to description; I've done a little scenario creating for D&D, and one of the minor things I did was to supply the titles of various tomes of magical theory and practice (not necessarily with any magical properties) in a wizard's library. Might be good for colour, or to explain why some book or other is particularly valuable.
 
You might find it interesting to check out the Mongoliad Foreworld Trilogy set in the period when the Mongols were threatening Europe. It is by Neal Stephenson and six other authors and was originally serialised. I personally disliked it as it felt disjointed - fairly inevitable bearing in mind its provenance - despite it's being re-edited into a trilogy of books.

However what was very good was the detail in its sword-fighting scenes, whilst maybe too much for some, I did find them quite fascinating. And I would believe they are very accurate as:
The Foreworld medieval adventure saga was actually born out of swordfighting. Stephenson and the other authors are avid practitioners of Western martial arts and they are part of an enthusiastic study group in Seattle. io9.com reports that Stephenson realized that the descriptions of swordfighting in his novels would have been much better with contributions from people with fighting expertise. Thus the idea for a saga about the complex, bloody history of Western martial arts was born, featuring Neal Stephenson, Greg Bear, Mark Teppo, E.D. deBirmingham, Joseph Brassey, Erik Bear, and Cooper Moo.

So, as I understand, all the authors of this series have actually fought with the weapons they write about. This is what first attracted me to the series and the fight scenes are exceptionally good, if a little technical. Unfortunately I found everything else about the books - pace, continuity, plot, characters - pretty dreadful, but then I seem to have a major problem with Stephenson's writing as I have failed on several of his books; not yet finding one that I have liked.
 
IMO the character experience is king.

And from what I've read up on fighting - not least Violence, A Writers Guide by Rory Miller - the last thing most people is going to do, in a life or death situation, is be cool and calculating enough to know exactly what they are doing. That apparently requires skill and experience.

Miller actually makes a point that the skilled martial arts students he trains become a fumbling mess when hit by a big rush of adrenaline, and will usually come off worse than unskilled fighters due to loss of co-ordination caused by adrenaline.

Therefore if the author can provide a prolonged blow-by-blow account of close melee combat, they have almost certainly dropped the reader out of the character experience.

Authors who claim any kind of fighting experience tend to have very short one-on-one fight sequences.
 
Certainly there is balance in this and some novels will appeal to different people; there will always be those that focus more heavily on certain kinds of descriptive elements and might end up blocking out a segment of the readership. I think that by integrating basic and advanced technical terms it is certainly possible to at least maintain a larger proportion of readers

Agree.

The English translations of Chinese names of "forms" sound lovely.

Well, I prefer the Japanese term "kata'. However, when I use it, people keep giving give me uncomprehending looks. I wonder why... :rolleyes:

Also, crucially, it wasn't too long.

A good description of a sword fight was given by David Weber. His protagonist had no choice but to engage an evil antagonist in a sword duel. The duel itself was described in a couple of paragraphs, but the author scattered several short episodes across the text where he described the protagonist's sword training. In total, those episodes fully explain what and how she did, but as they are short, they don't distract the reader's attention.
 
I prefer the Japanese term "kata'.
That's different.

I just think these names sound lovely. It's more about exhibition than real combat of course.
I think Robert Jordan draws on Chinese style names for positions.

55 named forms for Double Edged Sword
http://www.egreenway.com/taichichuan/sword55.htm

Fifty five movements of classical T'ai Chi Ch'uan in the Yang Style
Abbreviated version of the names/descriptions of the Classical Yang 55 Movement Sword Form:

1.


Preparation and Opening
Taiji Sword Beginning Posture
Step Forward and Unite with Sword
2.


Three Rings Circle the Moon
Three Bracelets Embrace the Moon
Circling the Moon Three Times

3.


The Big Dipper
Great Star of the Literary God
Big Chief Star
Symbolism and Lore about this Posture

4.

The Swallow Skims Across the Water
Swallow Searches the Water
Swallow Dips Its Beak in the Water
Technique: Chou (Cutting from right to left and upward)

5.

Block and Sweep to the Right
Right Block and Sweep
Obstruct and Sweep Right
Techniques: Dai (Deflecting), Xi (Catching), and Chou (Cutting)

6.




Block and Sweep to the Left
Left Block and Sweep
Obstruct and Weep Left
Techniques: Dai (Deflecting), Xi (Catching), and Chou (Cutting)

7.



Little Star of the Big Dipper
Small Star of the Literary God
Little Chief Star
Techniques: Ya (Pressing or Pushing Down), and Chou (Cutting Upward)

8.



The Swallow Enters the Nest
The Yellow Bee Enters the Hole
The Wasp Enters the Hive
Technique: Ci (Thrust low with two hands on sword)

9.

The Agile Cat Catches the Rat
The Spirit Cat Catches the Mouse
The Clever Cat Catches the Mouse
Techniques: Beng (Explode with flat blade), Tiao (Springing and Leaping), Ci (Thrusting with two hands on sword)

10.


The Dragonfly Touches the Water
Dragonfly Slaps the Water
The Dragonfly Sips Water
Techniques: Ge (Blocking), Ci (Thrusting with two hands on sword)


11.


The Bee Enters the Hive
The Wasp Flies Into the Hive
Yellow Bee Enters Cave

12.

The Phoenix Spreads Its Wings
The Phoenix Spreads Both Wings
the Mythical Bird Opens Its Wings

13.


The Whirlwind Moves to the Left
Left Cyclone
Left Tornado
14.


Little Star of the Big Dipper
Small Star of the Literary God
Little Chief Star
15.

The Whirlwind Moves to the Right
Right Cyclone
Whirling Wind Swings Sword
16.

Waiting for the Fish
Relax and Wait for Fish
17.


Parting the Grass Looking for Snakes
Looking for the Snake in the Grass
Part the Grass to Look for Snake
18.


Holding the Moon
Embrace the Moon
Clasping the Moon to the Bosom

19.

The Bird Flies Into the Forest
Bird Goes to Roost in the Forest
Send the Bird Up Into the Tree
20.

The Black Dragon Whips Its Tail
Black Dragon Waves His Tail
Purple Swallow Inclines Wings

21.

The Wind Blows the Lotus Leaves
The Wind Moves the Lotus

22.


The Lion Shakes Its Head
The Lion Shakes His Mane
Lion Nods Head

23.



The Tigress Holds Her Head
The Tiger Puts His Head Between His Paws
Tiger Covers Head


24.


The Wild Horse Jumps Over the Creek
White Horse Leaps the Crevasse
The Wild Horse Springs Over the Mountain Stream

25.


Rein in the Stallion
Turn Around and Rein in the Horse
Turn Body and Rein the Horse

26.


Step Up
Step Forward - The Compass Needle Points South
Step Up to Compass Needle

27.


The Compass Needle
Step Forward - The Compass Needle Points South
Step Up to Compass Needle

28.



Shaking the Duster in the Wind
Wind Flicks the Dust
Face the Wind, Brush Away the Dust

29.


Push the Boat with the Current
Follow the Current, Push the Boat
Send the Boat Downstream


30.


The Comet Flies by the Moon
The Shooting Star Catches Up with the Moon
Comet Chases the Moon

31.


The Heavenly Horse Gallops Across the Sky
Heavenly Horse Travels the Void
Celestial Horse Transverses the Void

32.



Roll Up the Screen
Lift the Curtain
Raise the Body and Lift the Curtain


33.



Cart-Wheel Sword to the Left and Right
Left and Right Cart Wheels Sword
Roll Sword Arms Like a Cartwheel


34.


Great Peng Spreads Wings
The Mythical Bird Spreads Its Wings
Great Roc Spreads One Wing

35.

Scoop Up the Moon from the Bottom of the Sea
Fishing the Moon Out from the Bottom of the Sea
Lifting the Moon From the Bottom of the Sea;
36.


Holding the Moon
Embrace the Moon
Clasping the Moon to the Bosom

37.


The Night Demons Explore the Sea
Knight Demon Probes the Ocean;
Yaksha Searches the Sea

38.

The Rhinoceros Gazes at the Moon
Rhino Watches the Moon


39.


Shoot the Wild Goose
Shooting the Wild Geese
Turn Body, Shoot the Hawk;

40.

The White Ape Offers the Fruit
The White Monkey Offers Fruit
The White Ape Presents the Fruit
41.


The Phoenix Spreads Its Wings;
Great Roc Spreads Wings


42.



Straddle and Cross Block to the Left and Right
Left and Right Step Over Obstacle
Halt - Left and Right With Step

43.
Shoot the Wild Goose

44.
The White Ape Offers the Fruit
45.

The Flowers Fall to the Left and Right
Scatter Flowers to the Left and Right
Left and Right Falling Flowers

46.


The Fair Lady Weaves with the Shuttle
Fair Lady Threads the Shuttle
Jade Girl Weaves Her Shuttle


47.


The White Tiger Swings Its Tail
White Tiger Wags Tail
White Tiger Hits with His Tail

48.
The Tigress Holds Her Head

49.



The Carp Jumps Through the Dragon Gate
Fish Leaps the Dragon Gate
Carp Leaps Over the Dragon Gate

50.



The Black Dragon Coils Around the Jade Pillar
The Black Dragon Twists Up Pillar
Black Dragon Twines Around the Pillar

51.

The Immortal Points the Way;
The Holy Man Points Out the Way
The Immortal Points Out the Road
52.
The Wind Sweeps the Plum Blossoms
53.
The Tigress Holds Her Head

54.


Presenting the Tablet
Step Forward - The Compass Needle Points South
Step Up and Point

55.


Transfer the Sword and Return to the Original Position
Enfolding the Sword, Returning to the Beginning
Rest the Sword, Close, Return to Wu Ji

Other info

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/103-form_Yang_family_tai_chi_chuan
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yang-style_t'ai_chi_ch'uan
 

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