The Revived Tolkien Trivia

[cornelius]

I thought Pukel Men were Druédain, and they're known for being "short lived for men". Or that's how I recall it.

 

[farntfar]

Cornelius.
I must admit to not being aware of this reference to "short lived for men", which isn't to say it doesn't exist. I haven't all the allowed books, notably some of the posthumous ones. But anyway, it wasn't what I was looking for.

Given the incredible number of replies, I've clearly gone off into my own little world again. So maybe some pointers.


All the Pukel men references required are in the LOTR, and indeed in one chapter.


And once again its all about names and relationships.

 

[Pyan]

Umm - you've possibly been a little too obscure here, far - after a full week without a post, I think that you may either have to give everyone a pretty good clue to the answer, or possibly even give us the solution, and set a new question.

 

[Grimward]

Yep. I'm not proud; another clue wouldn't hurt here, either!

 

[farntfar]

You're both right. I'm far too obscure. Sorry!
So, a clue.
On one side of the equation, Merry thinks of the Pukel men just after having been addressed as Master Bag.

 

[farntfar]

Clearly no help.

So try this.
What have Ghan-Buri-Ghan and Turin got in common?

 

[Grimward]

One of Turin's names (when he came to live among the people of Brethil) was "Wildman of the Woods", and Ghan-buri-Ghan of course IS one of the Wild Men of the Woods. I know this is about names, but must be denser than the wood in Gandalf's staff (and far less intelligent, for that matter); I'm not making it back to Hador, Galdor and the others...

and they both have 'uri' in their names, but if that's the similarity you're looking for, I'm at yet another dead end...

 

[farntfar]

and also we have both left all the accents of their names (Ghân-Buri-Ghân and Tùrin)

You've got it, but I'm being too cryptic again.
Going back to the Merry reference I made earlier, just after Elfhelm tells him to Pack yourself up, Master Bag, he sees G-B-G and is reminded of the Pukel-men.
Here was one of the old imagess brought to life, or maybe a creature descended in true line through the endless years from the models used by the forgotten craftsmen long ago.

Ergo, the wild men of the woods are descended from the Pukel men as Turin is descended in direct line from Marach, Beor etc.
And then as you say, the wild man of the woods bit.

Sorry for wasting everyone's time!
Take my twisted bell Grim, and bring the game back to life.

 

[Grimward]

Argh. And all I could come up with was some connection to "Father"...

Well, no one ever said I was the sharpest tool in the shed.

Not a waste of time, far; the best hiding places are in plain sight. Direct line descent was there for all to see.

Where might point and counter-point be labeled?

 

[Grimward]

Time for the groaning clue: Won't need to hang this one out to dry.

 

[farntfar]

Well I began by thinking it had to be the 3 farthing stone or something, but your groaning clue makes me think its the river Entwash, which divides the East Emnet from the West Emnet of Rohan.

 

[Grimward]

A reasonable offering, but wide of the mark. Your search tactics, however, are defensible...

 

[Grimward]

Hmm....

*Conducts the cricket chorus for a little while and ponders hint, then....*

Even the most congenial discourse can get heated and go south...

 

[Grimward]

OK, I've clearly put EVERYONE to sleep.

If one were to tote one's grey Lorien canoe up to Far's Entwash location, then drift lazily (and magically, where Rauros is concerned) the discussion could become heated two deltas thence....

 

[hopewrites]

*utterly baffled* I'm no good with maps.

 

[farntfar]

ok
so from all the secondary clues, it's the label South Gondor on the map.
marked (Now a debatable and desert land) on the maps.
So Won't need to hang this out to dry because it's a desert
and Even the most congenial discourse(debate) can get heated (desert again) and go south(South)

But where's the point and counter point?
Is it Gondor and South Gondor next to each other?
Is it South Gondor, next to South Ithilien?
I'm not sure.

 

[Grimward]

*Grins*

A debate involves point and counterpoint. South Gondor it is. Have yet to run across the illumination as to why it's debatable, other than the Corsairs of Umbar clearly no longer owed any allegiance to Gondor.

A not-so-debatable and dry bell to you, Far, and the honors of posting the next challenge.

 

[farntfar]

Thanks Grim.
I got stuck in this idea of north/south, East/west and didn't think of the other meanings of point.
A terrific question though.

I've got nothing prepared, so you'll have to wait for the next question.

 

[farntfar]

Sorry for the wait. I'm a bit snowed under at the moment.
Something a bit more straightforward to give you a rest from my twisted logic.

Who wrote well and speedily?

 

[Pyan]

That would be Ori.

It's Gimli talking about the handwriting in the remains of the book that the Nine Walkers found in the Chamber of Mazarbul while traversing Moria.

"That would be Ori’s hand," said Gimli, looking over the wizard’s arm. “He could write well and speedily, and often used the Elvish characters."

FotR, Book II, Chapter 5, The Bridge of Khazad-dûm



Hantanyel órenyallo - now these I can do - it's the chain-of-logic ones that baffle me...

Baffle, baffle, baffle, baffle - what a great word...