New king of fantasy is coming

[Jonathan Sarkos]

Hi everybody.

This is my first thread here and I'm fully prepared that it may be controversial for some of you.

As we know the entire world believes JRR Tolkien as greatest fantasy writer ever. It will remain like this forever. Not only because udeniable class and value of his work. It will also stay like this because JRR was first writer ever to introduce big, epic, and excellent fantasy story. Flawless, although not for everyone. Nevermind cause I don't want to write about JRR and things I regard faulty in "Lord of The Rings"

I want to write about new fantasy king and the king comes from...no, not from USA, Australia, UK, or France. He comes from Poland.

In fact he already came at the beginning of the 90's but obviously he's not been famous in UK, USA, or Western Europe since then. It's rather clear because it's much easier to gain worldwide popularity wtiting in English. Mc Killip, Gemell, Brooks, Williams, Eddings, Gavriel, George R. Martin, Robert Jordan and few others are very good writers beyond any doubt. But none of their books are real rival to "The Withcher" by Andrzej Sapkowski. Witcher is the most outstanding series written in fantasy after "Lord of The Rings". Witcher breaks almost all fantasy conventions, has more humour than all fantasy books gathered togehter, contains great characters (including supporting and background ones of course) tells great and unconventional story, it's written in exceptionally intelligent manner. Witcher is fresh, colourful, full of action, and full of life. You can expect everything from it and every surprise of many included will be positive.

How many times did you read reviews in newspapers or magazines hailing almost every new release as words I used: brilliant, outstanding, marvellous, exceptional, heartbreaking and so on ? How many times they all turned out to be completely wrong and written only to attract customer's attention ? This time situation is completely different...

You may think now that I'm posessed, drunk, silly, naive, ridiculous, on drugs or something like this. I swear nothing like this takes place. If you see Sapkowski's name on cover of a book in your local bookshop don't hesitate even a second and buy it. It may be the greatest day for you as fantasy fan. On one condition - if books and stories are translated well cause Sapkowski uses plenty of old fashioned and sophisticated vocabulary from various domains of life. ic can be very hard work for translator.

And does Witcher challenges "Lord Of The Rings" ? It may sound like a heresy for you but in my opinion definitely yes.

Witcher consists of several short stories and 5 books from series: 1) Blood of Elves 2) Time of Scorn 3) Baptism of Fire 4) Tower of the Swallow 5) Mistress of the Lake.

Witcher is not only a book. It's also a movie made in Poland about 5 years ago. In common opinion the movie is complete misunderstanding mainly (but not only) due to low budget. Both Sapkowski and screenplay writer backed off from it. There is also a computer game being created due to be released in March. You can see on youtobe.com

You can also read about Andrzej Sapkowski in British edition of Wikipedia. it's completely not truth that Witcher is influenced by Polish history and Slavic mythology. Anyway "Last Wish" should be already released in English. And it's just the beginning...

 

[the_faery_queen]

proof is in the pudding. if it sounds good, i'll read it and then see what it hink. but i personally dont' think there is such a thing as the best, or the greatest, of antyhing. everything is open to difference of opinion. people value different things differently.

i, for one, don't like tolkein

 

[Jonathan Sarkos]

Being psychologist I have to agree with you. World is great because its diversity so everyone can find something special for himself. I'm aware that Robert Howard's books are totally different from MZ Bradley's, Tolkien's from Zelazny's, or Le Guin's from Robert Jordan's. I like most of them but Witcher...Frankly it's a different story, some would even say different quality (but I don't go that far) . Hope it will be shortly released in UK, USA, Australia.

Tolkien will maintain his position whether we want it or not . Whether we consider him the best or not. And of course the most popular things are not always the best.

 

[Cricket - Best Sport]

As we know the entire world believes JRR Tolkien as greatest fantasy writer ever. It will remain like this forever. Not only because udeniable class and value of his work. It will also stay like this because JRR was first writer ever to introduce big, epic, and excellent fantasy story. Flawless, although not for everyone. Nevermind cause I don't want to write about JRR and things I regard faulty in "Lord of The Rings"

No. No. Undeniable? Hardly. No. No.

Sapkowaski seems worth learn Polish for, though.

 

[Lucien21]

Personally, at the moment, G R R Martin is the best. (i'm not a Tolkein fan either)

But as has been said Vive la Difference. Wouldn't life be boring if we all liked the same thing.

Never heard of this guy, but will look out for it. I had heard of the game coming out next year called "The Witcher" The Witcher Official Website

 

[Jonathan Sarkos]

I like Martin as well. First of all because of his versatility. I've never read his story or novel which was average. All I know were at least good and majority very good.

 

[finvarre]

Well, Sapkowski is certainly the best Polish fantasy/historical fiction writer, and a very original one at that. His books have already been translated into many languages, including German, Chech, Russian and many others.I do heartily recommend reading his witcher Geralt series when they come out in English (BTW, I do hope that the translation is good and does justice to Sapkowski's style). As I've checked on Amazon, THE LAST WISH ,the first volume of the saga consisting of 7 stories written in the years 1986-93 is going to be released on 19th of April by Gollancz. Here's the synopsis:
Synopsis
Geralt de Riv is a sorceleur, a man whose magic powers, enhanced by long training and a mysterious elixir, have made him a brilliant fighter and a merciless assassin. Yet he is no ordinary murderer: his targets are the multifarious monsters and vile fiends that ravage the land and attack the innocent. He roams the country seeking assignments, but gradually comes to realise that while some of his quarry are unremittingly vile, vicious grotesques, others are the victims of sin, evil or simple naivety. One reviewer said: 'This book is a sheer delight. It is beautifully written, full of vitality and endlessly inventive: its format, with half a dozen episodes and intervening rest periods for both the hero and the reader, allows for a huge range of characters, scenarios and action. It's thought-provoking without being in the least dogmatic, witty without descending to farce and packed with swordfights without being derivative. The dialogue sparkles; characters morph almost imperceptibly from semi-cliche to completely original; nothing is as it first seems. Sapkowski succeeds in seamlessly welding familiar ideas, unique settings and delicious twists of originality: his Beauty wants to rip the throat out of a sensitive Beast; his Snow White seeks vengeance on all and sundry, his elves are embittered and vindictive. It's easily one of the best things I've read in ages.'

A nice book to read for GRR Martin fans, though it's certainly very different from LOTR, IMO there's no sense in comparing these books. And LOTR IS and shall remain the very best epic fantasy ever written, whether you like it or not .

Just thought I could be helpful, after such a long absence from this forum.

 

[Rane Longfox]

Tolkien is certainly not the greatest. At least, not among those who know what they're talking about...

 

[Alurny]

I have added it to my Amazon wishlist. Love the sound of the story. Will purchase on release

 

[Pointfinder]

Hply crap! I never knew you could actually write a Polish accent! OK, you got me interested, I'll buy the book.

 

[Rane Longfox]

Out of interest, why would we think you were drunk or on drugs?

 

[ambershadow]

sounds like something i would read. There are some that think that about anyone who has a different opinion. I am a Tolkien fan but I know that not everyone is and I enjoy hearing about their favorites

 

[Green]

Did I just read a half-page advert?

Out of interest, why would we think you were drunk or on drugs?

I thought he was the guy's publisher

I would read it if recommended to me by someone whose opinion I value, but the synopsis posted by finvarre doesn't really appeal.

 

[Somebloke]

Welcome to the forums. But if this is viral marketing we are so going to kick your arse.

 

[Brys]

Hi everybody.


As we know the entire world believes JRR Tolkien as greatest fantasy writer ever. It will remain like this forever. Not only because udeniable class and value of his work. It will also stay like this because JRR was first writer ever to introduce big, epic, and excellent fantasy story. Flawless, although not for everyone. Nevermind cause I don't want to write about JRR and things I regard faulty in "Lord of The Rings"

I want to write about new fantasy king and the king comes from...no, not from USA, Australia, UK, or France. He comes from Poland.

In fact he already came at the beginning of the 90's but obviously he's not been famous in UK, USA, or Western Europe since then. It's rather clear because it's much easier to gain worldwide popularity wtiting in English. Mc Killip, Gemell, Brooks, Williams, Eddings, Gavriel, George R. Martin, Robert Jordan and few others are very good writers beyond any doubt. But none of their books are real rival to "The Withcher" by Andrzej Sapkowski. Witcher is the most outstanding series written in fantasy after "Lord of The Rings". Witcher breaks almost all fantasy conventions, has more humour than all fantasy books gathered togehter, contains great characters (including supporting and background ones of course) tells great and unconventional story, it's written in exceptionally intelligent manner. Witcher is fresh, colourful, full of action, and full of life. You can expect everything from it and every surprise of many included will be positive.

How many times did you read reviews in newspapers or magazines hailing almost every new release as words I used: brilliant, outstanding, marvellous, exceptional, heartbreaking and so on ? How many times they all turned out to be completely wrong and written only to attract customer's attention ? This time situation is completely different...

You may think now that I'm posessed, drunk, silly, naive, ridiculous, on drugs or something like this. I swear nothing like this takes place. If you see Sapkowski's name on cover of a book in your local bookshop don't hesitate even a second and buy it. It may be the greatest day for you as fantasy fan. On one condition - if books and stories are translated well cause Sapkowski uses plenty of old fashioned and sophisticated vocabulary from various domains of life. ic can be very hard work for translator.

And does Witcher challenges "Lord Of The Rings" ? It may sound like a heresy for you but in my opinion definitely yes.

Witcher consists of several short stories and 5 books from series: 1) Blood of Elves 2) Time of Scorn 3) Baptism of Fire 4) Tower of the Swallow 5) Mistress of the Lake.

Witcher is not only a book. It's also a movie made in Poland about 5 years ago. In common opinion the movie is complete misunderstanding mainly (but not only) due to low budget. Both Sapkowski and screenplay writer backed off from it. There is also a computer game being created due to be released in March. You can see on youtobe.com

You can also read about Andrzej Sapkowski in British edition of Wikipedia. it's completely not truth that Witcher is influenced by Polish history and Slavic mythology. Anyway "Last Wish" should be already released in English. And it's just the beginning...

Well I don't believe that the crown of fantasy belongs to Tolkien, or that he's even remotely a contender. Sure, he's the most influential fantasy author out there, but he's hardly a good writer. His literary skill is entirely lacking compared to authors like Peake, Marquez, Rushdie, - in fact, pretty much any good author. I dislike, or at least don't like, Tolkien's LotR for most of the same reasons as Moorcock. Saying something is better than Tolkien is hardly heresy for me - in fact, if it isn't, I probably don't want to read it.


This Sapowski sounds moderately interesting though - a complex main character who has realistic motivations. And possibly not a particularly nice person. In the Martin tradition, maybe? At the moment I'm reading Sergei Lukyanenko's Night Watch (incidentally also a film) - and it seems that the Russian/Eastern European tradition of epic fantasy is often more interesting than most Western epic fantasy.

And LOTR IS and shall remain the very best epic fantasy ever written, whether you like it or not

Even in epic fantasy, I think the current generation completely outclass Tolkien - GRRM, Bakker, Lynch, Erikson, even Abraham and Abercromie. All of them have a better understanding of character, the first 3 at least are better stylists than Tolkien was at his best, and they all are willing to do the unexpected and don't succumb to nostalgic sentimentalism. The definition of epic fantasy of course is a problem - unfortunately not one Moorcock addresses in Wizardry and Wild Romance - but he includes authors such as Harrison, Peake and Wolfe - all of whom are hugely superior to Tolkien. And even someone using very similar source material, publishing at the same time, Poul Anderson, provides a more satisfying epic which is actually a serious novel rather than a childish fairy tale.

Sorry to hijack the thread, but I dislike hearing "Tolkien is the best and will always remain so" or equivalent. No one has that position - there can always be someone better, and there are always equals, or those who come very close, but may do that in a very different way. I recognise Tolkien was an excellent worldbuilder, but I think that's entirely separate from his quality as a writer.

 

[Jonathan Sarkos]

Did I just read a half-page advert?



I thought he was the guy's publisher

I would read it if recommended to me by someone whose opinion I value, but the synopsis posted by finvarre doesn't really appeal.

No I'm definitely not. I wrote like this because I assumed that many of you could think that good fantasy is almost only written by English-writing authors cause such a way of thinking is rather obvious considering that origins of fantasy are beyond any doubt in UK and USA and most of worldwide culture trends comes from these countries. This regards "drinks or drugs" of course

No serious publishers are involved in internet forums. I'm common reader. I've never seen Andrzej Sapkowski himself, although I've heard some rumours that he is rather not nett and kind towards people. His new series also has been completed recently with releasing the last part of Hussitie wars (named after Jan Hus, Czech philosopher, reformer, master of Prague University - a man who should be regarded as one who started protestant movement long before Kalvin, Zwingli and Luther) trilogy and I have to say that in my opinion it's not as good as Witcher although still worth mentioning. Witcher takes place in trurly fantasy realm, Hussitie trilogy takes part in Europe in XV century and it's historical fantasy.

What are the other great advantages of Sapkowski and his style apart from mentioned ? Sapkowski tends to criticise modern fantasy. Of course he appreciates many of writers and series but generally thinks that the vast majority of fantasy is boring, predictable and written without any interesting, fresh ideas, without any quality - only for money (and I agree with him: in my opinion authors like for example Piers Anthony, Robert Jordan, Pratchett they started good or very good series but only first nowels were of high quality). Tolkien and Le Guin are the two to describe as excellent in his opinion but not because their series all the best (one lady above wrote that every person can choose his own favourites because everyone is different has different model of world in his mind and fully I agree with it) but first of all because they created two main motives of fantasy. By the way I'm also not much of Tolkien fan. I reckon "Lord of The Rings" as great saga for people between 15-19 years of age. Of course one can read it being older but when you are 20 or more you see that "Lord" is very naive. But as I wrote before: whether we want it or not it will remain the most important fantasy series worldwide forever. Unless Sapkowski will overtake it. (ok, all we know it's impossible ).

Sapkowski serves delightful mixture. he uses plenty of old fashioned vocabulary, gives new meaning to proverbs and sayings, uses them in style. His characters are "unpredictable": one person may appear somewhere in first part of saga as a minor, background character you forget about him/her and he/she suddenly appears in the last part of saga and all situation is seen with this person's eyes. He 'doesn't care' about time flow. Narration is achronological and it's another advantage cause novels remain coherent. Sapkowski uses chapters, but they are separated by "*" so each chapter has several smaller parts. Some of them are as short as several lines of text, only several sentences. In such a part of a chapter there is a woman colonel Julie Abetamarco the mercenary fighting in big battle. AS finishes her story on the battlefield and from the next "*" we see Julia 65 years after battle as very, very old woman talking about this long gone time. Both these small chapters are as long as one page. There's much more dialogues and action than descriptions that's why it isn't boring at all. What's most spectacular is that none of Witcher novels is worse or better than the rest 4. All of them are at the same great level and each of them has its own character! His realm is exceptionally tangible. No pompatic at all, very naturalistic. One of characters Leo Bonhart says these words for example:

'you are not afraid of death ?' he throbed, bending her head to the ground. 'Look at this, this is how death looks like. This is blood, that's bowels, that's ****. That's how one is dying'.

Sapkowski is never naive, almost always realistic (but we are talking about fantasy of course ). All modern world and human nature are reflected in his books. There are no invincible characters. Although Geralt is great swordsman he is also vulnerable and may be defeated. Elves are beautiful in appearance but they fight with cruelty against human (scoia'tael bands). They kill human and they are catched by human and killed with he same cruelty. But as I wrote before plenty of things is unpredictable in his books: in one scene several peasants are running away from raging war on their carts and they see few elves coming their way. Peasants think that their hours are counted but elves approach and human see that they are poor, defeated, broken and hungry. Without their normal pride, all in despair. My translation beneath is very ordinary. Unfortunately I'm not familiar with many of English words, idioms, or sayings but I hope it's showing much.

"Lucienne comprehended in a second. She understood what elf is looking at. As a peasant she was familiar with starvation and hunger since her childhood, so she reacted instinctively and without any hesitation. She gave the bread to the elf woman.

'En'ca digne luned' - repeated elf. Only he had silver lightnings of brigade 'Vrihedd' on his torn sleeve.

Peasants on the card petrified and freezed in motion because of fear until now all moved almost at the same time as if they were forced by a spell. In their hands pulled towards elves bread, cheese, pork fat and sausage appeared.

And elves for first time for hundreds of years pulled their hands to human race.

Lucienne and Jarre were first humans who saw elf crying. How she's crying not even trying to wipe the tears from her beautiful face now covered with dirt, despair and fatigue. Denying the common opinion that elves are unable to cry.

'En'ca...digne' repeated elf with lightnings on his sleeve.

And he also pulled his hand and took the bread from Derkacz.

'Thank you' he said roughly trying to adjust his tongue and lips to strange language. 'Thank you human'.

And it was almost twilight when the road became full of armed horsemen. They were commanded by a woman with white hair, and evil face full of scars. Woman looking at them with evil, full of revenge sight asked about elves, Scoia'tael, terrorists. She asked about survivors from elvish commando wiped out two days ago. Jare, Lucienne and the rest of their company answered avoiding her eyes that they didn't see or meet anybody.

'You're lying" thought White Rayla who used to be Black Rayla before.'You're lying, I know it. You're lying because of mercy'.

'But it doesn't matter, doesn't matter at all'

'Cause I White Rayla, I don't know what mercy is'

Disadvantages ? They are everywhere, in every book. Some people can be surprised that characters of Witcher's world know modern genetic or economy language but 1)Sapkowski is economist himself and 2) genetics is essential to understand story and importace of one of main characters. But this can be incoherent a bit for some people.


Some of you know for sure "Hyperion", "Fall of Hyperion", "Endymion", and "Rise of Endymion" byDan Simmons. For me the Witcher is counterpart in a sense. I mean that AS also created very vivid world full of threads. Full of different emotions, full of different characters, full of life.

But unlike Simmons AS finished his story. I wish Simmons would do the same as well.

Although I'm neither AS publisher nor his friend or relative I wish him worldwide success. And worldwide succes takes place only when something is successful in UK or USA. For one and only reason: he really, really deserves it.

PS Brys: I would say the same about Frank Herbert, Arthur C. Clarke or Isaac Asimov (especially the middle one) what you said about Tolkien. They abilities to create and invent was much better than their writing talent. Night Watch is great.

PS II Title of this thread was deliberately provocative although everything I wrote becomes valid in 100% .

PS III I forgot to say about one very important thing: much depends on translation and my opinion above about Pratchett, Anthony or Jordan is based on Polish translations of these authors. Still I regard all of them very good.

 

[Brys]

At the moment I'm really noticing the differences between the film and book - I think it's quite good that they give different interpretations of the same material.

The thing with Herbert, Clarke and Asimov is that few people claim they're the unbeatable best of science fiction or the only one worth reading. And there are three of them. But I pretty much agree - they've each written some books that are reasonably good, but they aren't brilliant. I'll admit I really enjoyed Dune, but I don't fool myself into thinking it's excellent literature or even the best of SF.

Back to the topic - the Hussite wars trilogy might be interesting. And you're one of the first people I've seen who remembers to mention Zwingli as one of the key reformers.

 

[Jonathan Sarkos]

Back to the topic - the Hussite wars trilogy might be interesting.

It depends. As usual . For me the main disadvantage is that there is far too much "deus ex machina". I mean that main character is caught by his enemies, released by them, caught again by other enemies, set free by his friends, caught again and so on. It's still very, very detailed about reality of those times, it's great because of language. The other things I don't like too much are 1) already mentioned main character Reynevan called also Rainmar Bielau and 2) the end of trilogy.

Returning to AS himself: his popularity in Poland is ENORMOUS. In the country were really big issue is approximately 30 000 copies, his books are printed in about 10 times more issue. And it's interesting sociological phenomenon because it doesn't happen often in the world that something is really of the greatest quality and extremely popular. Not only in the literature of course.

So my conclusion is that in the 'world of worlds (by this term I mean that every person on earth creates his own world, his model of world in his mind. many of elements are common, but even more individual. preferences are the best example) popularity of AS can't be accidental and is surely not nine-days wonder considering that his first short story was released 20 years ago. I can explain it in two ways. 1) his books contain huge number of various merits/values and every reader can find something for himself and/or strongly identify with one or more characters 2) some people were encouraged by strong recomendations of other people, and it was like a rock starting a avalanche which lasts until now.

 

[Jonathan Sarkos]

One curiosity for English readers especially those interested in history: in first chapter of third novel of Hussite Trilogy entitled 'Lux Perpetua' Sapkowski writes about Battle of Herrings which took place in Rouvray in 1429. And the battle is described by sir John Falstaff himself .

 

[Cricket - Best Sport]

Even in epic fantasy, I think the current generation completely outclass Tolkien - GRRM, Bakker, Lynch, Erikson, even Abraham and Abercromie.

This is the funniest statement I have heard for a long time. Thanks for the giggles.