The Fool's Gender? (possible spoilers)

These books see to diverge from the only slightly ambiguous 'bromance' that so often appears in long-running fictions - Sam and Frodo in LoR, Starsky and Hutch, and map out a real romance. A male-male, non-physical romantic relationship.

But the a flashback to his previous life - in Assasin's Quest with dragons about the place - the fool was female, wasn't he?
 
I'm not completely sure if that was explicitly a previous life. Was it perhaps a previous prophet or a similar persona from a previous time that both Fitz and Fool have a link to and /or share a has a vision of?
I might need to re-read that part.

However even if he was female in a previous life does that really necessarily mean that he is physically female in this life? I would say not IMO
 
The Fool himself seems to identify as male and Fitz had been in his body when fixing it so I believe that he has male characteristics. He is however quite androgynous in appearance and there may be some duality of gender.
 
re posting from another forum where I am trying to make a case to myself that Fool is a female... (maybe not human female). Am re reading the trilogies with one of the posters here that Amber is unambiguously a woman, whereas Fool in Farseer and TM was less certain a man. Otherwise, why so many "hints" and so purposefully ambiguous in the Trilogies? Also, in FF when Fitz brought Fool back to life, RH never once wrote that Fool was naked. I think we all just assume that... as I did on the first read. Re-reading FF, it was less clear on whether he was clothed or not. My case or Fool as female as summarized...

* If I had read LiveShip first, I would never have guessed Amber is anything but a she. No one (not the ship, Jek, Althea etc..) questioned Amber's gender even when living in close quarters.

* In LST, Amber taught Althea how to dress, speak, walk like a man. She talked about binding her breasts, having a fastidious personality, waking early and sleeping late, and using dark rags for menstrual cycles and then often washing the rags pretending they were dirty socks to avoid questions (come on... would any man even think about disguising menses??). So referencing this back to FE when Fool spent time with Fitz in cabin. Fitz noticed that the water barrel was already empty because Fool washed so often.

* Throughout the Trilogies, the Fool was always awake and dressed before everyone else. In Golden Fool, he often went to bed later than Fitz or was already in bed when Fitz came into the room.

* The Farseer and Tawny Man trilogies were in Fitz's POV, so in his obtuse perspective, Fitz saw Fool as a man because that's what made him the most comfortable. Fool knew that and had to remained disguised as a man in order for Fitz to continue confiding in the Fool. He tells everything to the Fool.

* Both Starling and Jek recognized the Fool/Amber as a woman. Both Starling and Jek were described as luscious women with healthy heterosexual appetites and keen awareness of their bodies and sexuality. As such, of all people, they should be the most credible when calling the Fool a woman. They are most likely to notice a lack of manly physical traits like Adam's apple, shadow of moustache, toilet habits etc...

* In GF, Jek called Fitz stupid and cruel for not recognizing what the Fool was.

* In GF, Amber told Jek that no one could spoil Fitz's face (with broken nose etc..). Amber gave a "pretty" little sigh.

* In GF, When Fool and coterie were channeling way too much Skill to heal Fitz, Fool shrilled "like a woman" for them to stop.

* In FE, when Fitz and Fool reunited after 15 years, they hugged - the Fool described as "he clung to me like a woman".

* After AQ, a "woman" was said to have delivered two horses to Burrich. Why describe a woman not a man, messenger, Chade etc.. Isn't horse delivery usually a man's task?? so why specifically a woman. Could that be referring to Fool now as Amber on her way to Bingtown after the Red Ship wars were over? So Fool/Amber brought the horses to Burrich because that's what Fitz wanted.

* Fitz notices Fool's features all the time - long slender fingers, gracefulness, aristocratic features, coloring etc.. I don't recall him really noticing the other women as much or in that much details. Innately, I think Fitz responds emotionally to Fool as a woman but mentally and sexually rejects the idea of Fool as a woman.

* In FE, after Fool saved Fitz from being trapped in Nighteyes, Fitz (looking at Fool) "I recognized and rejected a truth I did not want to know".

* In GF, Fool showed Fitz his tattoos but covered his front. Most men (I know) would have just dropped the towel without even thinking about covering the front. Only a woman with breasts would think about covering the front.

* In FF, Fitz found Fool dead in the ice chamber. At no time did RH ever mentioned the Fool being naked. Most readers assumed that Fool was naked as did I the first time I read it. The Fool was all balled up with legs scrunched up to his chin. The sack cover was frozen to his body. When they went to forest where it was warmer, the Fool was described in rigor mortis so he was still scrunched up when Fitz exchanged bodies with him.

* In FF, Fitz was inside the Fool's body, and Fitz "I thought I had known him... I had always believed that we were more alike than different. It simply was not true". So, Fitz always thought of the Fool as a man like himself, but inside the Fool's body, Fitz realized that Fool is not anatomically a man like Fitz... If Fool is not a man, then he is actually a woman. That is how I am reading it! Recall also, that Fitz doesn't know a whole lot about what the inside of a woman's body look like and may consider the the womb, ovaries, mammary glands etc... as strange.

* In AQ, Fitz and company found some hot spring pools during their mountain journey. Fitz went to bathe in one, the women (Kettricken, Kettle, Starling) went to bathe in another further away but Fool chose to not join them but sought to bathe in private.

* In AQ, towards the end when dragons awoke, Fool kissed Fitz. I think in that moment, Fool reacted like a woman in love who may never see her love again.

* In AA and GF, the Fool had girly fancies like thinking that the breakfast flowers came from Fitz and that the Fool's room in the tower had a baby doll and other girly decorations.

* In RA, itz asked Shrewd persmission to marry. Reaction from the Fool - "the Fool's eys grew round with surprise" (so, obviously the Fool was caught off guard... maybe thinking Fitz meant this for her/Fool). When Shrewd (thinking it was in reference to Celebrity) said "I am well pleased with your choice". Fitz's response and more importantly, the Fool's response - "the smile that broke out of my face was amazingly echoed by one on Fool's countenance".

* White Prophet - Catalyst pairings are always man-woman. Why not Fitz-Fool?

* In FF, when Fitz and Fool spoke for the last time about parting, Fitz asked Fool to "could you for once simply say whatever it is you are trying to say". To which, the Fool looked like he was seriously considering telling Fitz his secret then "he smiled sadly" and said he cannot tell the secret without "damaging something precious" to him (Fool). Really, what secrets can there be left?? Fitz already knew that Fool loved him with no limits, body mind and soul. My guess is Fool almost told him about his true gender which is of a female.

So there! That's my case for Beloved being a woman.

Side theory: I think Beloved is still young as a White and the gender not truly developed. He will become a woman eventually. For now, Beloved shows traits of a woman which he has to hide until his body fully develops. Somehow I think that each fever and skin changing helps Beloved evolve further into his true gender as a woman. Prilkop and Pale Woman are clearly man and woman because they are much much older and therefore fully established in their genders.

Side hope: I hope the Fools Assassin trilogy finally allows Fitz and Beloved to be with each other. Fitz can skill-prolong his life (like Kettle) and live out a long life with his Beloved.
 
Since we do not know the people that the Fool comes from,it is impossible to say the Fool is male or female by our standards.
Early on,in the Farseer Trilogy,I thought the Fool was female.It was after Fitz went into the Fool's room,when the Fool was not there,and he found the little crib with a doll in it.
Since then,I have changed my mind so many times,first female,then male etc.
Now I believe that the Fool is closer to being what we understand as male.
In the latest book,Fool's Assassin,the Fool seems decidedly male,but as the next books come out in this trilogy,I wonder if Robin Hobb will surprise us all by revealing exactly what the Fool is.
 
"Side theory: I think Beloved is still young as a White and the gender not truly developed. He will become a woman eventually. For now, Beloved shows traits of a woman which he has to hide until his body fully develops. Somehow I think that each fever and skin changing helps Beloved evolve further into his true gender as a woman. Prilkop and Pale Woman are clearly man and woman because they are much much older and therefore fully established in their genders."
I have been thinking about this over night,raistlinmajere,and I think you could be right.I would love the Fool to be female and end up with Fitz.
 
Haven't read Fool Assassin yet so don't tell me anything more :)

The Fool's gender has been such a huge debate (Farseer was published over 10 years ago!). If RH reveals anything at all, it won't be till the very last book (to be published in....?!!). She will keep us guessing till the very end most likely.

I do hope she addresses it definitively at the end - man, woman or both - after 12 books, I would really like some resolution!

Of course being the hopeless romantic, I am biased for Fool to be female! Simply because Fitz will always be heterosexual. So the only way Fitz and Fool can be together is for Fool to be a woman. Also I definitely cannot see or stand Molly as Fitz's "one true love".

I have this horrid feeling Fitz and Fool will have a tragic end where they finally acknowledge their love but somehow forever separated like Realder the white prophet and her beloved catalyst who gave his life to the dragon that never took flight.
 
The current Fits and the Fool books it becomes clear that the gender issue isn't at all clear :)

Especially with issues around Bee and "The forgotten Son" :)
 

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